Statement from Shaw Lane owner

Discussion in 'Bulletin Board' started by Tyke1, May 8, 2018.

  1. Sup

    SuperTyke Well-Known Member

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    As far as I'm aware there is no such rule. The closest rule I can find is as follows:
    A Club competing in any one of The Premier League, The Football League, The Football Conference, the Southern Football League, the Isthmian League and the Northern Premier League shall not be permitted to change its playing name (i.e. the name under which the Club competes in a Competition), as recorded on Form “A”, save with the prior written permission of Council.
    Any application for a change of playing name must be received by The Association on or before 31 December in a playing season in order for it to be considered by Council for adoption in the following playing season. Council will use its absolute discretion in deciding whether to approve a change in a Club’s playing name.
     
  2. Cod Eye

    Cod Eye Well-Known Member

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    I've only heard about it a few times in the past. Once was when FC United of Manchester was formed, and the FA wasn't happy due to the rule. Obviously something was sorted though as they use the name now.

    I know that there were some rule changes when the Cardiff owner tried to change the club colours and Hull wanted to change their name. The F.A. put something in place to protect the club identities, even covering the clubs primary colours. That may be something to do with it...
     
  3. Cod Eye

    Cod Eye Well-Known Member

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    There must be some rule or law, as if there wasn't Shaw Lane would have just plowed ahead with the name change and there wouldn't be anything the club could do, despite their superior wealth. As mentioned in the post above, there was a rule implemented recently protecting clubs identities following the Cardiff City colour change and the Hull owners wanting to change the club name. It may be a knock on effect from that?
     
  4. cho

    chop Well-Known Member

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    There is mention of the change here in an article on the whitehawk application. And if this wasn’t the case this thread wouldn’t exist would it. AFC Barnsley would already be named as such. The FA rule book has a lot more sections than the pdf version on line

    https://www.google.co.uk/amp/www.theargus.co.uk/news/14213136.amp
     
  5. Jay

    Jay Well-Known Member

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    There isn't. The only rule regarding name change is the one quoted by Supertyke earlier:

    A Club competing in any one of the Premier League, the EFL, the National League, the Southern Football League, the Isthmian League and the Northern Premier League shall not be permitted to change its playing name (i.e. the name under which the Club competes in a Competition), as recorded on Form “A”, save with the prior written permission of Council. Any application for a change of playing name must be received by The Association on or before 31 December in a playing season in order for it to be considered by Council for adoption in the following playing season. Council will use its absolute discretion in deciding whether to approve a change in a Club’s playing name

    It's rule A 3(l)

    Full set of rules are here:
    http://www.thefa.com/-/media/files/...17-18-final/014_rules-of-the-association.ashx

    The key sentence is "Council will use its absolute discretion in deciding whether to approve a change in a Club’s playing name" which basically means they can reject a name change for whatever reason they like, they don't have to justify it, they don't have to follow any rules or guidelines, they can just do exactly as they please.
     
  6. cho

    chop Well-Known Member

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    If we are taking the ruling in black and white it also doesn’t specify that you can’t call yourselves tigers but Hull City were refused. In the end the FA has the right to refuse any name change but there must be a reason for the decision. The article I posted referenced the change as part of the reason for refusing Whitehawk to incorporate the name Brighton. I assume this reason got to the reporter via one or both clubs. Using this logic and the fact there is no rule 3z stating anybody who supports a crap club from Sheffield 6 can’t use the name Barnsley I’ll stick to the logic of teams having similar names. If not why are they not already called AFC Barnsley, unless I missed rule 3z.
     
  7. Jay

    Jay Well-Known Member

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    Because the FA can refuse the name change for whatever reason they like as rule A3(l) clearly states.
     
  8. cho

    chop Well-Known Member

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    But I assume they have to state the reason for their decision rather than just say “sorry we looked but no” I have read the rule but decisions are supported by reasons.
     
  9. Jay

    Jay Well-Known Member

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    No they don't, it's entirely at their discretion, they don't have to follow any rules or guidelines, it's entirely up to them for whatever reason they like.

    You know when you hear complaints about the FA, how they're a closed shop of old blokes with no rhyme or reason to their decisions - it's because of situations exactly like this. They're a law unto themselves and always have been, and as barmy as it seems, that's how they conduct their business.

    In this situation, I'm quite happy that they refused another team the right to use Barnsley in their name, but in reality there is no logic to the decision, no rules that were followed.
     
  10. Tarntyke

    Tarntyke Well-Known Member

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    Can’t believe all the posts in this thread going into the ins and outs of including the name Barnsley for Shaw Lane FC. This Guy states he’s proud to come from Barnsley, has family and friends who are Barnsley fans, then apparrently Tweets something along the lines about Karma because of our relegation, and then says it’s not aimed at fans. Why didn’t he either just STFU and not post anything at all, or post some commiserations type post to Barnsley fans. I don’t buy it, reap what you sow, you have shown your true colours as far as I’m concerned. I won’t even consider now going to watch them.
     
  11. cho

    chop Well-Known Member

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    OK we both see this differently but I will leave it with a statement from Whitehawk FC regarding the reason for the refusal for their name change. They mention both the reason and the rule change which I'm sure was supplied to them by the FA. That's enough evidence for me.

    https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&sou...FjAAegQIBRAB&usg=AOvVaw3nc41SGiR-58JrxZI3pwnT
     
  12. Sup

    SuperTyke Well-Known Member

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    I've done some digging and it seems there isn't any actual rule which specifically stops this, nor has there been any rule change. What there is is rule A3(l) which gives them the right to reject a name change for literally any reason.
    BUT there has been an informal (that's the key part) change of policy and thinking which gives existing clubs greater powering objecting to any change which they feel harm them. There is no specific or written rule change but there has been a shift in attitude.
    Whitehawk applied to change their name to Brighton and Hove City and it was knocked back by the fa old boys after Brighton objected with as you say the owner referring to a rule change. This wasn't actually a rule change just an opinion and attitude change. Since they were knocked back whitehawk then applied to become simply Brighton City which demonstrates that there isn't a specific rule otherwise they would have known it was a waste of time.
     
  13. Lone Striker

    Lone Striker Well-Known Member

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    Am I alone in thinking someone should start a plumbing/water services firm called Aquafarce or similar, recruit all the best plumbers in the area, upset small firms with apprentice plumbers etc etc and await a response?
     
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  14. wak

    wakeyred Well-Known Member

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    Dark times though, with that you-know-what in charge.
     
  15. pon

    pontyender Well-Known Member

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    Those clubs were so named when the Football League wasn't as strict about it.
     
  16. andytyke

    andytyke Administrator Staff Member Admin

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    Am I only one who doesn’t see anything wrong with what he is doing. I think Bfc are pathetic
     
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  17. Tarntyke

    Tarntyke Well-Known Member

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    Well the OP was about a tweet he made about our relegation. That’s pathetic
     
  18. pon

    pontyender Well-Known Member

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    I think the name becomes an issue the higher up the pyramid a club gets. That's why Shaw Lane had to remove Aquaforce from its name.
     
  19. red

    redrum Well-Known Member

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    This^^ the tweet went down like a lead ballon especially with the replys tweeted. I know people sometimes go watch them when we play away and a few were wanting em to beat mansfield. Obviously thought about it and decided karma might well and truely bite him on the arse.
     
  20. Euroman

    Euroman Well-Known Member

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    AFC Barnsley were set up to destabilise our club when Mr. Doyle was the owner. The FA didn't have any problems letting them use the name then. Ask yourself who bankrolled AFC and why funding stopped after a few years.
     

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