Brexit confusion - Scottish fishermen

Yesterday I was approached by a recruiter for what would be to me, an ideal job. I'd still have to sell it to the wife and get through the interview, etc, but I had to turn it down purely because it was based in Munich and I could not move to a new country when I cannot *at this time* guarantee we'd be able to stay after March - or if we could stay that my wife would be able to work, or my daughter able to visit for more than a couple of weeks at a time.

The job was for a banking organization and will pay rather a lot of money

 

Regarding this TV debate: it seems hard to argue that May and Corbyn's views are the only ones around (that's if anyone knows what Corbyn's is because it seems: 1) In a state of flux and 2) Not in line with the majority of his party's view).

And why is she touring the country when it's the MP's she has to convince? Is her fallback position a second referendum?

 

I watched bbcqt last night and you had Zahawi trying to peddle his political line that's been trained to death.... and he doesn't come across as believable at all. Long Bailer for Labour who you could paraphrase all night with the sentences made up of "quite frankly" "shambolic" "general election" "what we're saying is" and "we've been quite clear". Obviously intermingled were things that didn't make any sense and were far from clear.

Some fairly fresh talking from the new lib dem MP and then the quite bizarre musings of the wetherspoons boss and I can't recall the other guy, other than I always think he was on red dwarf but wasn't.

The frightening thing for me (and granted its cornwall) was the number of people in the audience willing to just walk away and sod it all. The political rhetoric hasn't helped that to some, this is seen as the only option, they don't believe any warning of any type, and the only way they would believe that is if they felt it... though I suspect it would still be someone elses fault, not theres for pushing for such a radical risk based outcome.

Day by the day, the randomness continues, and I think all this pr offensive does, is irritate people all the more as it doesn't appease anyone at all.

 

Well it’s ok to work in a place like Brazil or South Africa, take your wife and have family visit for more than two weeks. (I know this from experience). So why wouldn’t you?

If you really turning down a dream job like this... you need to research what realistically will happen. Otherwise you’re falling for more spin. The spin from both sides is destroying any thoughtful and realistic debate.

 

I think a second referendum is the only way of saving her job & possibly her Brexit deal & she has realised that now, hence finally releasing the government forecasts for her deal / no deal / remain.

She has a lot of public sympathy & could well win a vote for her deal, although secretly one suspects a vote for remain wouldn't affect her badly either. When the deal gets voted down in the House of Commons (as it surely will) she has few alternatives left. Labour are tabling an amendment to stop us leaving with no deal & Labour would be in favour of a second referendum, which I think would get passed.

 

I've got to say.... if it were me, I'd be taking the opportunity. I can't see no deal happening on any side. If Mays deal is voted down badly I suspect we're on for a 2nd referendum. If it starts to fall apart I'd be very surprised if the EU didn't agree an extension of article 50. No deal suits nobody and causes huge harm. The chances, despite it being whipped up to gain support for May, is pretty unlikely I reckon.

And surely the bank aren't going to offer the job to someone who they don't think will be able to reside. Your choice. But if its what you want, be brave.

 

i'd wager money on there being a second referendum,the spin and stories of apocalypse are worse now than prior to 2016 and for me are there solely to frighten the public to death in the hope that some will have changed their minds and would now vote remain..

I must say tho,i still think the vote would be to leave as all this intimidation and threats are only strengthening the resolve of folks i speak to, much in the same way as those in cornwall were saying on bbcqt last night,they simply are not being swayed and see the eu as nothing but bullies who are now showing their true colours.

 

Obviously I have a different stance, but there are two things that are interesting here, and I certainly accept there are large numbers of people who feel this way, however this judgement has been arrived at. Firstly, this notion that the EU are bullies. I know others will disagree, but how they've negotiated, the unity, the transparency, the outline of process with 27 individual countries completing each deadline has been a pleasure to watch. Especially compared to how the UK has approached this. We've been woeful, and thankfully, thank god the EU have done so much of the legwork because otherwise the UK would still be working out what to do after the early article 50 triggering. Politicians for decades have been fighting enemies, some real, many perceived and created, and if they weren't mongering verbal spats with the EU, they'd be doing it somewhere else... as they often do.

People may perceive the EU are bullies, but they are just efficient and thorough and have rules. I've said it before, if shoe were on the other foot, the british leavers would take umbrage at being labelled bullies. It's a perception, largely created by a right wing press that is much more prevalent than anything left or centrist or pro European. Perception doesn't always equate to truth. In any sphere.

The second thing, the very british trait of spiting ourselves in the face of any alternative view or any evidence to the contrary. Stoic til the end.

A second referendum may well produce a leave result. I have no issue with that. What I do have issue with is a country taking a course of action that varies greatly from a subjective translation and perception of a non binding referendum result where truth was limited and lies were most common.

Now that people know more and more discussion has been generated over 2 years, it makes obvious sense to ensure what people thought they were voting for is mirrored by the actions they want govt to take. I can't think of anything more democratic and sensible.

People have a right to change their minds. To suggest otherwise is irrational. If more people still want to leave the EU, fine. That's what will happen.

 

This pretty much mirrors what I feel.

A 3 way choice that is fairly worded and done on a single transferable vote system makes sense, if the House can't agree.

 

My view now is that if Parliament votes May's deal down it's a straight-up referendum between remain and no deal Brexit.

 

This might be a stupid question, but if, in theory, we did hold a referendum and decided to remain, would the EU accept us back like nothing had ever happened? Or would there be consequences to causing 2 years of chaos? I'm not talking about their opinion of us, I'm talking hard facts - ie, would we still pay the same amount in, get the same benefits etc as we do now.

 

My understanding is if we decided to stay in and provided we paid for all the negotiating expenses etc we would just carry on with same benefits etc.
If we leave and decide to rejoin we lose all our privileges we have now and any influences thereof and will be subjected as a new member .

 

This pretty much mirrors what I feel.

A 3 way choice that is fairly worded and done on a single transferable vote system makes sense, if the House can'

I think you'd have to include May's deal. I think it would be more popular than some people might think. With a transferable vote system it would still be fair for remainers and leavers

 

There is a court case in the ECJ to determine whether we can unilaterally withdraw A50 notification. The government has fought it all the way (make of that what you will) through the Scottish Courts to the ECJ. A summary is expected next week with the full decision likely around a week or so afterwards. There would probably be consequences - not least of which is the lack of MEPs after the elections in April or May next year (ours have been reallocated), but the political language suggests that they would make accommodations if we changed our minds.

 

First thing the EU would do is make us use the euro instead of the pound . They've got us hook , line and sinker, checkmate , by the short and curlys in a big old 27 to 1 neck hold . I think we'll be fine

 

WTF

 

I don't think they would at all. I think they would just be glad for us to call exit off. They have freely admitted it will be damaging for the EU as well as the UK. Although more so for us, obviously.

 

german industry is actually lobbying the eu to stop a hard brexit as they are more than aware that one would be a disaster for their own economy

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/arti...y-warns-of-massive-crisis-from-no-deal-brexit

 

It's certainly a game of who blinks first .