The mess is mainly because the people in charge are fighting about what should happen... the fighting is on both sides and will not be resolved because everyone believes they are right. Everybody has an axe to grind and spanner to Chuck in. The news agencies are loving it, as there is an easy stream of scandal and crap. The Europeans are loving it, because we are showing all our cards every time, and will in all likelihood not leave.
Just as an aside... did anyone see the C4 programme, "Sleeping with... the far right"? I'm not sure I'd recommend anyone to watch it as such, but if you just happened to see it, then it was curiously unedifying. How the woman managed to spend more than an hour in the company of the guy and his family and peer groups, I really have no idea. Instead she endured a week. Can safely say Southport is crossed off my to do list... on hang on, it was never on there anyway, phew!
I can assure you the Europeans aren't loving it at all, we're creating global uncertainty, and its damaging our friends and colleagues on the continent as well as ourselves.
The mess is needless and pointless. The EU are not the enemy some like to claim, it’s a shame that so many believe so.
Facebook is an echo chamber, and local/interest groups like that attract similar people. More of us have traveled out of the area for varying amounts of time. Perhaps if those in Wath realised exactly how much EU funding the town had got over the last few years they'd be a little less set in their ways. All the development at Manvers was EU funded, as was the environmental work at Manvers Lake and the waterfront. Unfortunately, Wath is a deprived area with relatively low educational attainment and comparatively low EU immigration. Prime targets for the Leave snake-oil salespeople. Although I have overheard someone in Wath saying they were looking forward to sending all the immigrants back home (while sat in the queue in the Chinese on Sandygate)...
8 months ago, I said to my wife that the media had started mentioning “no deal” & that this would increasingly be reported - others sai”no, no, no” to me as no one (in their right mind) would want that. I kept saying to Watch this space. Gradually, it became used more & more (initially as a bargaining tool) but now, so many people are stating that a no deal is what they voted for! Remember the old adage -1st they came for the miners (ie the bloody tidies) - well now, it’s 1st they came for the Europeans, next it’ll be the Muslims (all terrorists), then the catholics (abusers), then the pensioners (nearly me), then the youth (hooligans, no respect - there’ll be no one left (except Rees-Mogg, Boris, Farage, Dyson who’ll all be elsewhere with their businesses). I’m 64 & said when the referendum result was announced that I was ashamed of my generation - I still am!
You do realise that it’s the EU International Organization that we are leaving. The U.K. will still be on the continent of Europe. You will still be European.
Under Mays deal or No deal though we lose our European Citizenship and right to freely live and work in Europe so we arent considered European anymore
I see May is delaying again proposing 3 votes in the middle of march - her deal no deal or delay - not sure what happens when the MP's Vote down Mays deal no deal and vote for an extension - I suppose the EU will agree but what changes - the Tories and DUP wont support Jezza's stay in the Customs Union and Single market deal so I dont where we go - other than we get months more uncertainty. Mind you we get that anyway - with Mays deal we then negotiate all over again the final trading arrangements ( or with No deal we have the same negotiation -though from an even weaker position especially if we dont pay the agreed leaving charges) - this is going to go on for a very long time of course the EU might not agree to an extension so despite what the MP's vote we may find ourselves with no deal regardless
So you have to apply for work permits, residency or travel visas, just as you do when going to the States, Canada, Australia etc.. We are still European - We just won’t be EU member citizens.
The selfish, greedy brexiteer Politicians got exactly what they wanted when the country voted leave, but oh no, it's not enough, they will only be satisfied when their get THEIR kind of Brexit, no compromise . I will laugh my nuts off if it all goes pear shaped and we end up staying in .
I doubt tourist visas will be an issue - other than costing most likely around a tenner work visas are a different matter all together - you do know how much harder it is to go and work in the USA for example than it has been in Europe its not going to be so easy for younger brits to travel and work as its been for people like me - and I may still lose my job as I am sold as a service to a company in Austria - currently its no issue for me to go there and work as needed - that could well change and they may be unable in future to offer the work to me unless they can show no one else in Europe can do it - They may decide its not worth the hassle
So will I - but I dont have much hope that will happen at the moment I reckon its going to be eventually no deal 50% chance some form of Mays deal with a backstop fudge 40%, something like Jezza is proposing 1% chance remain 4% - hope I am wrong
It's really immaterial. I'd rather be at the back of Obama's queue than the front of Trump's. Hostages to fortune.[/QUOTE] Whilst I don't disagree, Trump will most likely be gone for good next year, the worst case is he gets another four year term and normal service will be resumed immediately after.
Whilst I don't disagree, Trump will most likely be gone for good next year, the worst case is he gets another four year term and normal service will be resumed immediately after.[/QUOTE] Well on that point SB we are firmly in agreement although if Ocasio Cortez etc keep giving Fox etc the fuel to portray parts of the Democratic party as Socialist verging on Communist then Trump is always in with a chance.
Don't know if you saw the programme about the channel tunnel the last few weeks. Interesting on many levels, but the thing that really stood out for me. You had a huge emotional moment as France and Britain met at the assigned point. There were people crying. a feat of engineering, someone said Britain was no longer an island. Amid this, they'd been showing protests going on decrying the French, that we were British, that our way of life was in danger, that it would never be the same again. I guess being in the north at that time, I didn't really see all this going on. But it struck me just how similar things still are. That xenophobia and fear of anyone who doesn't look like they should be British is one this nations overriding characteristics. If there was a referendum asking whether to classify us as a nation of Europe, it wouldn't surprise me if a huge number wanted a separate classification, a nation and a continent. Just Britain. Ideally just England. Ideally segregate it a bit more between north and south. Who knows where it would end.
Bestowed austerity creating lawlessness and drug feuding where knife crime and drug dealing is epidemic Created a referendum without investigating consequences of one of the outcomes , Triggered article 50 without consultation,forward planning or compromise of our divorce settlement . Other than that what have the Tories ever done for us ?