Barry Hines, Orgreave..

Discussion in 'Bulletin Board' started by Mr C, Jun 4, 2019.

  1. Mr C

    Mr C Well-Known Member

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  2. Marlon

    Marlon Well-Known Member

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    Police were brutal that day and all the while the media were filming miners bloodied and under arrest whilst complaining the police were the victims .
     
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  3. Donny Red

    Donny Red Well-Known Member

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    There was an extract on Orgreave in the third part of " Thatcher - A Very British Revolution" last night.
    The Police were advising the pickets where they wanted them to park their cars. As one of the lads said
    " it's like they wanted us to be there." What followed, was absolutely brutal.

    The Police definitely over reacted that day and handed out some unmerciful beatings. One of my mates
    Dad had his head laid open and was never ever the same again. He went on to suffer from epilepsy and
    blinding migraines and died around 1989.

    The Miners retaliated and inflicted injuries on Police Officers, although rumours surfaced that some of
    the latter could well have been military personnel, but they had to offer some form of resistance to avoid
    being killed. Bad job all round.
     
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  4. Baz

    Bazza Well-Known Member

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    Justice for Orgreave one day will be done hopefully in my lifetime I was banned from attending Orgreave by my then ex wife.
    Probably one of her better decisions.
    Violent acts took place by both sides.however if the pickets would have been caught on camera doing what some of those officers they would have been locked away.
    It was orchestrated by the government and the NUM played straight in to their hands.
    Many lies told by the government BBC covering this story biassed.
    One day Justice for Orgreave ?
     
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  5. Tarntyke

    Tarntyke Well-Known Member

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    I was there that day and the one thing that stood out above everything else was the use of Agent Provocateurs. NUM officials and others were made aware of a large group of people at the top of the hill throwing missiles, which were hitting pickets and the police. When approached this group were verbally aggressive and basically just carried on. They were described as being men who all looked to be about mid 20s to early 30s and clean cut. Many believed they were military of some sorts. Not saying these were the only group that threw missiles, but these were the only ones that didn’t respond to pleas to stop.
     
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  6. Donny Red

    Donny Red Well-Known Member

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    Can easily believe that TT. My late uncle was a leading light in the NUM. In the days when the Pit Managers
    daughter was probably the only person to get the sole place from their village at the local Grammar School,
    whilst not having an education as such, he was a bright bloke and was eventually funded by the NUM to
    attend Ruskin College Oxford University.

    He was a Trade Unionist all his life and he always claimed that the military were used at the very first picket he
    ever joined in at the Kodak film strike at Grunwick. It said on last nights programme about Thatcher, that part of
    the reason the Government knew what the NUM were planning in the 1984 strike, was because they had paid
    informers who infiltrated the Union.

    My uncle always claimed that during his time as a Union official, he too was offered money to pass details on to Government officials about any leading NUM personnel and their activities in opposing to pit closures and new working practices.
    On the other side, British Coal approached him and offered him a job in Management on more money he had been earning, in an effort to weaken the effect of the Union at his pit. To his credit, he managed to resist all their advances and after his retirement was elected as a Councillor for Doncaster Metroplolitan Borough Council, well before Donnygate.

    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Grunwick_dispute
     
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  7. shed131

    shed131 Well-Known Member

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    My old fella was there that day... Bless him... He got chased more than once durring the strike.
    When I asked him why at 57 was he picketing... His reply was... To safe guard jobs for the young uns.
    I pointed out he'd refused to let me go down the pit even though I'd been successful in getting a job offer and that he had at 57 already been told he was getting his redundancy and given a finishing date too.. I continued your not 100% with your health not even 75% if truth be known and here you are putting yourself in danger.... He thought for a moment and said
    You've got a point ...I'm not well yes I'm finishing but them lads on the picket line need me... .adding I might be old and my best days are behind me....

    But at the end of the day.....
    Your never too old to chuck a brick....

    And with that turned around and went of to picket with his mates at Orgreave...
     
  8. How

    HowMuch! Well-Known Member

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    One of my Uncles was a strong union official in a steelworks and he was offered a managerial post when managers couldn't be in his particular union .
    He took the money .
    Put his young family first .
    Fair enough .
     
  9. Donny Red

    Donny Red Well-Known Member

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    Can understand why some lads might do that HM. The abiding memory growing up where I did,
    was that everybody appeared to be skint. The four main things the Miners in our village had ,were
    each other , their pit, the Working Men's Club and their Union.

    Some of the things that were done to the properties and individuals who broke their strike by returning
    to work in 85 were truly horrific and my uncle probably knew of similar incidents during previous disputes.

    He lived a modest life and looking back now, he probably would have enjoyed the extra money and the car he was
    offered, but being a miner all his working life, in the end he decided to remain loyal to the grass roots and he was
    respected for it.
     
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  10. Marlon

    Marlon Well-Known Member

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    That’s very true DR the police that day were very accommodating with miners .
    Some officers were indeed hurt by their own as the cavalry charged some horses bucked whilst still in their own lines no doubt they will have been told to say it were miners for compensation imo.
    We’d just had the miners gala at Wakefield the Saturday before the Monday at Orgreave where Scargill appealed for all trade unionists to make it the Saltley gates of 1984.
    There’s no doubt the police were given carte Blanche by their superiors the brutish behaviour proved that imo.
    It was like a battlefield miners laid out all over the field with officers bent over still hitting some whilst laid out .the cameras didn’t show a hell of a lot of what went off there’s still footage out there that would Shame the police if it ever were shown .
    Yes bricks were thrown and as ever it was the miners on the front line that came out worse the police had shields etc the miners had T shirts and shorts . We had many pleas to the rear of the picket to stop throwing as our lads were getting the worse of it but as Tarntyke said there were elements that wouldn’t and the military were mentioned on many occasions , apparently they were even hostile to top NUM officials asking them to stop so that says it all imo.
    The steelworkers at Scunthorpe have a lot to answer for using the coke from orgreave . I had stood shoulder to shoulder on picket lines a few years earlier with some of these and sometimes there were more miners than steelworkers on their picket lines . Comrades when they needed us enemies when we needed them .
     
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  11. dek

    dekparker Well-Known Member

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    too right about the steel workers marlon, they completely forgot the solidarity shown by the miners... do you remember going down old gates and drawing every third ring off to be sent back to the pit bottom for straightening ?, money collections for their strike fund etc

    cortonwoods coal went straight to scunny and at the begining of the dispute the steelworkers refused to even talk to our officials.One of the reasons given for the closure of corton was that old chestnut 'the lack of available markets', scunthorpe took nearly everything we produced as we mined the silkstone seam which produced some of the best thermal coal in the country.

    the cops were indeed very accommodating during the strike, especially in the months prior to orgreave, i've seen us play football and cricket with them at the top of cortonwood lane
     
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  12. Marlon

    Marlon Well-Known Member

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    I meant accommodating to lure us to our fate on that day as opposed to trying to stop us Dek.
    Your right about going into old workings to retrieve old rings because we refused to handle scab steel.
    Bill Sirs had been very vociferous against us when we went on strike but during the steel workers strike was very complimentary on the solidarity we gave them . Two faced too hat he was.
     
  13. dek

    dekparker Well-Known Member

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    i know what you meant bud.

    I was just pointing out that this picture of confrontation painted by the media was not always the correct one
     
  14. Marlon

    Marlon Well-Known Member

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    Yes it was always the police even though very little footage of officers hurt were ever shown , it was almost all miners that were beaten, bloodied and under arrest but according to papers like the Scum it were the police under attack .
    Talking to some police from the isle of White (Hampshire police ) at Cotgrave on one occasion and they were bragging as to how they had paid off their mortgages and some were going on holiday with family to Disneyland thanks to the miners .
    They were hoping the strike would go on for months .
    The police were never ever the victims and the people in the media should hang their heads in Shame. ( I won’t hold my breath though)
     
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  15. Hooky feller

    Hooky feller Well-Known Member

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    Was there that day. Remember the bricks coming from the back. Word had it at the time after it had calmed down. It was militant student supporters of the miners that were throwing bricks. Lots landed short of the police and struck miners. ( Police just raised shields above themselves to protect em ) miners near the back chased em off seeing what was happening. I personally found some of the police prepared to talk and even have a laugh prior to engaging. EXCEPT THE MET ******** the majority. Knew when they rolled up due to they're military style approach. Marching in file etc.
     
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  16. shed131

    shed131 Well-Known Member

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    The local police officers would turn a blind eye to most things and most had sympathy to the miners... it was the London Met and their army mates that were causing the trouble...(speaking from experience ) A friend of my old man who was in the local force once said... Its okay for the met to act this way in their eyes... But its us buggers that live and work here that will have to take the flack and pick up the pieces then police it... from the **** they are causing once the strikes over....

    I've posted it before... During the strike I was working on the Tacky and was stood waiting in the star bus stop in Cudworth to be picked up by the staff bus..
    Due to it being the early hours 3. 25am I was stood like I always did most early shifts with my tracky overcoat tracky peaked cap all clearly marked...
    Head pulled into overcoat collar half a sleep... Eyes closed..

    I heard a vehicle pass by then tyres screech a little then the noise of a vehicle reversing...

    Knowing it wasn't the staff bus by engine noise I paid it little attention..
    Suddenly there was the noise of a sliding door being slung open followed by loud voices and before I knew it I was grabbed and banged back up against the shelter...
    with the words ringing in my ears Where do you think yur goin yooo feckin cant
    Maybe I shouldn't but my reply was... Weir dus tha think am guin dressed like this... A f cuking fancy dress party
    To which I took two or 3 blows to my ribs followed by Answer my fecken question yoo northern cant... I was then banged up against the bus shelter a couple of times.. Took another dig in the ribs.. When suddenly the staff bus pulled up and the driver... ( dicky mint lol ) shouted oi what's going on.. The old bill then piled out of the bus top and one went on the bus to search the empty bus that was lit up like a Christmas tree
    Whilst doing so a panda car pulled up and one of the local bobbies shouted that's the local bus company picking up its staff for todays service not a picket bus.
    I took another dig come push as they all walked away got in their un marked white minibus and drove off
    My mate wanted me to make a formal complaint but it would have been pointless... Not one of them had any visable numbers on show... That's the London Met for you
     
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  17. dek

    dekparker Well-Known Member

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    old Roy(think that was his first name) Cusworth was walking through Brampton and the pigs set about him and put him in hospital, his crime? wearing orange overalls (he was on his way to his allotment), identical to the ones we had at the pit, Roy was a retired council worker and had never done a day at a pit in his life
     
  18. Donny Red

    Donny Red Well-Known Member

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    It was claimed that the Police with no numbers on their uniforms, were usually Military personnel. I played in a local football team and one of our players had a Sister who was engaged to a serving soldier. Her Dad was a Miner and was an active picket. Can't remember where it was, but my mate said his Dad had told him he had seen his future son-in-law amongst the Police ranks hitting the lads with batons. Not surprisingly the wedding didn't get to take place.

    Where I lived, the pit houses leading down to Hatfield Main Colliery, were on a mile long straight Road named Broadway. There were several incidents where Police with batons entered houses without a warrant looking for leaders of the picketing, because it was not safe to remain living in their own homes. The womenfolk and kids were terrified of them.

    Local coppers that we'd grown up with, were appalled at the tactics used and a couple I knew, actually resigned from the force as a result.

    Local folks were harassed and taken in for questioning at the local Police Station. We all used to say we were surprised they didn't imprison any of the local lasses who happened to be pregnant, on the grounds that they could be carrying a future picket.!
     
    Last edited: Jun 5, 2019
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  19. Baz

    Bazza Well-Known Member

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    I Bet the BBC never covered any of this I was very bitter for ten years or so but I have tried to move on
    This brings it all back to the forefront and reminds me of the democracy our grandfather's fought for.
     
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  20. Marlon

    Marlon Well-Known Member

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    I knew many miners who’d served in the military who sent their service medals back in protest of their treatment.
    We were regrouping at the Tesco store in Handsworth after being chased by the Horses when a group of lads from Sunderland were asking if their were any Yorkshire miners with a car .
    They had come down on bus and one of their group was so badly beaten he couldn’t walk but couldn’t go to hospital as they’d been told the police were waiting and arresting injured miners .
    The reason they wanted him picking up was that they’d sent word round for rest of their mates to get back to bus and they were gonna get their mate to Sunderland Hospital.
    The reason being he’d been arrested on a picket line at a Scottish Steelworks and if he was arrested on anotherr picket line faced five years in jail.
    Five fekin years some murderers didn’t serve that and that shows the police, judiciary etc were hand in hand with the Tory politicians to beat the miners .
     

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