Opinions are like arseholes

Discussion in 'Bulletin Board' started by Archey, Jan 15, 2017.

  1. Archey

    Archey Well-Known Member

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    So here's mine (opinion, not arsehole) about this, that and t'other.

    Sam Winnall:
    We all knew the day would come. It is how modern football is, players come and go all the time. Obviously it stings a little more as it's for a low fee to a local rival (they can deny it all they want but they love to talk about us). I listened to Radio Sheffield on the day it leaked that Sam had signed. The vast majority of Barnsley fans that rang in smacked very much of sour grapes. Going on about how Sam wasn't a good player; whilst that isn't correct, I will admit that we've had some considerably better footballers than Sam Winnall at this club. The problem is, very few have been a 20 goal striker like Winnall was. The problem isn't replacing Sam Winnall, it's replacing his 20 goals a season. Which leads me nicely onto...

    Omar Bogle:
    It's beginning to look like we're in for Bogle. Which considering his goal ratio is very similar to Winnall's (albeit largely at non league level), he's the natural choice. I've read a few say that £1 million plus on a largely unproven striker is far too much of a risk. I disagree. On the budget that we're constricted to, we're going to have to take gambles to keep progressing. When we were relegated from the Championship last time, we needed to rebuild, and at the same time trim the wage budget. Winnall came in, understandably for a sizeable fee for a league 2 striker with one good season under his belt. Bogle is no more of a gamble than what Winnall was, the difference being that we are a league higher, and the fee is more. There aren't many more suitable candidates in my opinion (other than maybe Tom Bradshaw, who certainly has the potential), and reading the comments of the Grimsby fan who occasionally posts on here, Bogle seems to have the knack of creating out of nothing; it beggars the question what he could do with creative players around him like Watkins, Hammill and...

    Conor Hourihane:
    Conor is still a Barnsley player. Let's enjoy it whilst he still is. I've run out of data on my phone so rather than intermittently checking the BBS on my breaks at work, I've been waiting until I get home to catch up; and I was convinced when I came home on Friday that a deal had been completed, and Conor had moved on. He was mentioned rarely in people's line ups, and it seemed as though Sheffield Wednesday had signed our entire squad. In reality, Conor remains available for selection, and Wednesday have taken one player from us, the same number as North Ferriby. It could merely be prolonging the inevitable, which places more emphasis on the Morsy deal being completed. The fact that Hourihane said he wished to discuss terms in the summer gives me a glimmer of hope that he's in it for the long haul. But then is it better if we take the money now? What's the financial detriment of a potentially lower league position without Hourihane. One player who I'm not concerned over transfer speculation is...

    James Bree
    And when I say that I'm not concerned, I don't mean because I don't think he would be a loss, he most certainly would, it's because we're due a fee from him irrespective of when he leaves. Bree is out of contract in the summer, and is under 22, so we would be due a compensation fee for him. It's worth weighing up what we're likely to receive from a tribunal against the offers on the table now and in the summer. That being said, if the only offer to come in is Aston Villa, I can see Bree staying here until at least the summer. He's a seemingly level headed lad who is relishing the opportunity to play here. I don't think he would take any move likely, and would only go for what's in his best interests, as he did when he signed a new 3 year deal with us with Man Utd interested in him. So I take a relaxed approach over this one in the knowledge that Bree will probably see the season out.

    Linton Brown:
    I have no idea how to take this one? It seems very sudden, poorly timed and coincidentally a day after a questionable outgoing transfer. I hope a replacement is in the offing. Although regarding Hecky's comments about Sam Morsy, things still appear to be moving forwards, and we're allegedly closing in on a loan deal for the lad from Blue Peter and Omar Bogle (if you believe all that you read, so maybe a decision shouldn't be rushed if the club can continue as it is for the time being. Get the appointment right.

    Fulham away:
    It would be rude not to comment on the game while I'm here. You run the risk when you're a good footballing team, of coming up against a better footballing team. We did that yesterday. Our plans B & C are to score from set pieces (the day after losing our top scorer) and to score on the counter. Plans A-C were all relatively innefectual to a superior Fulham side. We're going to have games where we are clearly 2nd best. Although I will make the argument that we only became 2nd best after going behind. Of course we went behind due to 2 very poor refereeing decisions in a row. The lad Cairney reminded me very much of Jordan Rhodes and the chap who got Preston promoted (name escapes me, think he's at Rangers now); quality players who don't need any additional help, but choose to cheat to gain an advantage. I'd be lying if I said Conor Hourihane was any different though. We became 2nd best after the opening goal. It's a kick in the teeth, we move on.

    The plan:
    It's only natural for us as human beings, and supporters of a notoriously underdog-ish (sorry, couldn't think of a better word) football team, to question everything when something goes wrong. We've had 12 months of everything coming up roses, and as soon as we hit a minor setback, we question everything. The club's plan has got us this far; the sale of Sam Winnall and potentially Conor Hourihane, won't alter that, in the same way that the sale of Alfie Mawson didn't, or the failure to bring back Fletcher, Brownhill and Isgrove at the start of the season, or the decision to move George Williams on, or the departure of Lee Johnson, or the sale of Mason Holgate. It isn't the first setback or questionable action during this era of Barnsley football club. It probably won't be the last. There's calls for us to blow the money we've made at the first sign of one of the graduates of our plan wishing to leave. What's the point of doing what we've been doing, if we revert to type the instant we start to feel uncomfortable. Questions are being raised about where we're going to get a replacement from, and whether they can make the step up to the championship immediately. It's 2 divisions difference from league 2 to the championship; the same gap as when we took Hourihane on, and Winnall, and Scowen, and one less than the gap between the championship and we're Robbo, Payne and MacDonald were. Have a little faith. Enjoy the ride. We're 10th in the Championship. Up them reds.

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  2. Con

    Connor Well-Known Member

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    Great post .
     
  3. Micky Finn

    Micky Finn Well-Known Member

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    Outstanding.
     
  4. Jay

    Jay Well-Known Member

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    The only thing I'm struggling with is that we're talking about spending more on a non-league forward than we got for a Championship forward. The plan doesn't work if you do that. The idea is we buy cheap and unproven, develop the player and sell him for big bucks. I'm fine with that, it's what we have to do to survive. I've no idea how you're supposed to survive if you sell the player you've developed over 3 seasons for half a million and then buy a completely unproven player for a million. The maths falls down at that point and the plan leads to bankruptcy.
     
  5. Cho

    Chopwell Red Active Member

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    Has there been an official announcement from either club that the fee was half a million? We only have one journalist "believing" the fee to be arround £500000 and every other journalist and BFC supporter taking it for granted to be the truth.
     
  6. ark

    ark104 (v2) Well-Known Member

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    Agree. The strategy has to be that players will not be sold during the last year of their contract. It makes sense to buy lower league players in January to let them bed in and be ready to replace departing players in the summer. But we aren't going to be able to replace Winnall's proven goals at this level in this window. We need to sell when players value is at a premium and get the most out of them on the pitch once their value declines.

    And extend our best player's contracts earlier.
     
  7. JLWBigLil

    JLWBigLil Well-Known Member

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    Is the Winnall transfer fee half a million? Even if it's true, doesn't that mean we're making a profit on him and means the plan works (especially after winning a trophy and promotion with him making a huge contribution)? Have our income streams increased since the Summer of 2014 when we signed Winnall? If we signed Bogle for £1M and sold him in a couple of years time for a profit, doesn't that mean the plan works?
     
  8. Cho

    Chopwell Red Active Member

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    There we go again "extend our best players contracts earlier" as if the player and his agent don't have an option not to!
     
  9. Archey

    Archey Well-Known Member

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    I see where you're coming from. I think you've to look at it on a player by player basis. We made a profit on Winnall, whether the 500k fee is correct or not. We could make one on Bogle too. The initial outlay is part of the issue. Whether we'd ever make our money back on Bogle is another issue all together. And of course is where the gamble takes place.

    It seems to be defenders that we have a knack for developing and selling on.

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  10. Sta

    Stahlrost Well-Known Member

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    You're right (obviously). What counts is the level of profit we make, not the actual outlay. It's always a gamble though, as injuries and crapness could intervene to scupper the cunning plan.
     
  11. JLWBigLil

    JLWBigLil Well-Known Member

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    I agree.
     
  12. ark

    ark104 (v2) Well-Known Member

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    Absolutely. And I don't know when/if we offered contracts and in this instance don't seek to criticise. I'm just saying that has to be the aim of the strategy. I would have been very surprised if Winnall and Hourihane wouldn't have signed contract extensions on improved terms last April, say. Historically, where we do know details, we've not been great at it. Butterfield was a prime example where the board were told to tie him down and waited too long.

    I also appreciate the risk that comes in offering contracts do. I'm not saying I'm right in any way, and again don't know any of the facts. Just giving my opinion on how we could continually improve.
     
  13. ark

    ark104 (v2) Well-Known Member

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    Very true. Sam has been a great signing. Brilliant for us and we've made a profit. My issue is that profit has to be balanced against worth. At this moment in time, even if he's gone for a million, you could argue that his worth to us until the end of the season is greater than that income. I would say more so with Hourihane. You have to balance all kinds of medium term factors like chance of play offs, cost of relegation, loss of momentum, consequent impact on season ticket revenue and so on. Plus the fact that players in future will feel they can force the club's hand if it suits.

    That all said I qualify all of the above with the fact that these are incredibly difficult decisions and I don't know any of the facts. He could have had a release clause for example. I'm not going to stamp my feet and I certainly hope that the club are proven to have done the right thing
     

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