Rant of the day....Socialism......

Discussion in 'Bulletin Board' started by Tekkytyke, Jun 13, 2019 at 10:41 AM.

  1. Tek

    Tekkytyke Well-Known Member

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    The reason socialism fails and will always fail is that activists spend a lot of time shouting loudly about inequality, racism, xenophobia, capitalism,nationalism, greed , inequality and rabble rouse.

    The problem is that complaining and blaming everything and everyone else for the World’s problems does not solve anything.

    Jealousy, envy and bitterness targeting the rich and powerful , many of whom have got where they were through hard work and talent, achieves nothing. Yes, there are many who do not deserve the riches they have accumulated but we live in an unfair, unequal society. There are also many wealthy who DO care and DO give back a lot to society, recognising that they are in a privileged position

    There are a number of ‘dyed in the wool’ socialists on here who bemoan the state of the world who have never done anything, have no intention of doing anything and never will in order to improve their lot. Typically, they regularly moan about ‘rights’ but, not surprisingly, rarely, if ever, mention ‘responsibility’. It is as if they believe the World owes them something.

    PS This post was prompted by another poster today citing “the problem is that we are only interested in ourselves and our own”. Life isn’t fair and we make the best of it we can. We can only look after our family first and if we can, try to help others along the way. At the very least we should try to get through life without hurting others. Nevertheless we are a competitive species, it is in our genes and you cannot change human nature. It is how we evolve.

    I await the usual slagging off from the usual suspects
     
  2. Birkdale Red

    Birkdale Red Active Member

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    “Socialism is the philosophy of failure, the creed of ignorance, and the gospel of envy.”
    “The inherent vice of capitalism is the unequal sharing of blessings. The inherent virtue of Socialism is the equal sharing of miseries.”

    So sayeth Mr Churchill. Who am I to argue?
     
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  3. North Yorkshire Tyke

    North Yorkshire Tyke Active Member

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    You raise some valid points. However:

    The only way to prove what you say is to look at different models all over the world.

    Socialism has often failed especially when based around the cult of one leader. However there have been some good points to what had been done. Compare the Caribbean countries. Which one is safest, has the highest education rates and best healthcare? Cuba. A communist country. Would I live there. No. But you can't help but admire their achievements over the neighbouring islands and appreciate how safe you feel there.

    Which is the safest and most educated place in South America? Costa rica, where they've have sustained periods of left wing rule.

    Which country has the highest gdp per capita in the entire world? Norway, a long term experiment in left wing rule.

    Would i live in new zealand or oz? New Zealand again a very left leaning country. Canada or America? No choice for me there either.

    If you think right ring countries are the best, where would you point to as an example?
     
  4. Tarntyke

    Tarntyke Well-Known Member

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    You’re not worth the time it would take to reply in full. If I’m jealous, bitter and envious about wanting to live in a more fairer, caring society then so be it. I think you ought to see if there is such a thing as travelling back in time then you can jog off back to the 18th/19th Century where you clearly belong. This post says more about you than anything else. Glad I don’t know you .
     
    Last edited: Jun 13, 2019 at 11:09 AM
  5. MonkeyRed

    MonkeyRed Well-Known Member

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    You have totally misunderstood Socialism.

    It's not about 'jealously, greed and envy' and isn't about personal circumstances as you seem to think but about the nurturing, protective and collaborative side of humankind which isn't as essentially competitive as you claim.

    You're assuming it's an individualistic outlook whereas it's about collectivism. Most socialists consider themselves to be privileged in comparison to many others and seek to redress the distribution of wealth to prevent suffering and exploitation of those who are unfairly and unnecessarily disadvantaged. On behalf of others, not for themselves or their families.

    I think you should ask socialists a few more questions about why they think what they do before making ill-informed generalisations.
     
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  6. AthersleyRed

    AthersleyRed Well-Known Member

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    Churchill also killed a lot of Indians. Who were they to complain?
     
  7. AthersleyRed

    AthersleyRed Well-Known Member

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    Also, the clue is in the names Socialism/Capitalism. One is conscious of a group, one is to promote the status of an individual. The very nature of politics is to be conscious and work in the interests of a group.
     
  8. Til

    Tilertoes Well-Known Member

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    When people realise you need both then we may start getting somewhere.
     
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  9. bfc

    bfc1001 Active Member

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    It's a good job the war generation used socialism to rebuild Europe post WW2 or we d all still be living in rubble and bombed out ruins if left to capitalist markets . That we ve virtually destroyed nearly everything that great generation created for the sake of profit is the reason Europe is in the state it is .
     
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  10. Sco

    Scoff Well-Known Member

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    He was also in charge of the British government when we opened concentration camps in Kenya - less than 10 years after the end of WW2.

    When people realise that the countries most often held up as examples of "bad" Socialist (USSR, North Korea, Venezuela), are actually extreme Capitalist (small number of very "rich" individuals with the majority of the population in relative poverty), then we may get somewhere. Both ends of the spectrum end up being the same.
     
  11. Red

    Redhelen Well-Known Member

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    Socialism - to each according to their need.

    Doesn't seem a bad way to run a country to me

    The idea that socialism pulls everyone down is ridiculous.
     
  12. North Yorkshire Tyke

    North Yorkshire Tyke Active Member

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    When people realise that the countries most often held up as examples of "bad" Socialist (USSR, North Korea, Venezuela), are actually extreme Capitalist (small number of very "rich" individuals with the majority of the population in relative poverty), then we may get somewhere. Both ends of the spectrum end up being the same.[/QUOTE]

    Absolutely spot on.

    And in actual socialist countries like Norway life is actually brilliant for the people
     
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  13. RedStriker

    RedStriker Well-Known Member

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    Got a feeling that this one may run for a bit.
     
  14. Mr C

    Mr C Well-Known Member

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    Looks like I've logged into the Chelsea forum again, by mistake.
    What a tool..:(
     
  15. Micky Finn

    Micky Finn Well-Known Member

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    Good, it should. Hopefully address a few lazy assumptions head-on.
     
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  16. E3R

    E3Red Member

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    Without inclusive social policy we wouldn't have the NHS, or the welfare state. Jog on and vote Tory.
     
  17. Donny Red

    Donny Red Well-Known Member

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    A far greater person than Churchill said " Love thy neighbour as thyself for Gods sake."
    You only have to go to London and see the Changing of the Guard, the Tower, Westminster Abbey or
    get an inside view of the workings in Westminster, to know that there's no chance of ever changing anything,
    because you would not be allowed to. The politicians don't influence what happens behind the scenes.
    They are totally under the control of very powerful, wealthy, influential people all with vested common interest
    ( i.e the Establishment). I've witnessed it with my own eyes.

    My old Dad used to say to me " remember son, you will never own the garden, just be content to be
    able to get in there and smell the flowers now and again."
    I was taught to respect my elders and where possible try where possible to help people less fortunate than myself.
    I'm a Socialist and am quite happy with my "lot" and can honestly say I don't and have never envied anyone.
     
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  18. Terry Nutkins

    Terry Nutkins Well-Known Member

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    The amount of people that still get confused with Socialism and communism is unbelievable.

    They then add in communist states that are run by Tyrants as though that adds weight to their misconstrued arguments.

    It’s utterly mental. Progressive, Democratic Socialism would make Barnsley and places similar into far better places to live then they currently are, yet people on the bread line in our town think it is the most evil thing imaginable.

    It’s the most ‘wibble’ thinking ever. They'd rather vote for the Tories, or Farage (A smoking Tory in a pub) than someone who lives his life trying to stop phoney wars and make life fairer for all.

    As I said utterly mental.
     
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  19. RedStriker

    RedStriker Well-Known Member

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    Excellent. Something to get me off to sleep.
     
  20. Dar

    Darfield138 Active Member

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    It is a bit difficult to strip out an example of pure socialism, maybe Cuba. Norway wouldn't describe itself as socialist and in any event has a small population and large natural resource income to distort GDP. To be fair some who have espoused socialism have been dictators such as Stalin, Pol pot and Mao so their disasters couldn't be attributed to socialism more to them personally
     

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