Thanks Keir

Discussion in 'Bulletin Board' started by Tyketical Masterstroke, Sep 22, 2020.

  1. Dav

    DavidCurriesMullet Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 9, 2017
    Messages:
    3,345
    Likes Received:
    6,144
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Hemingfield
    Style:
    Barnsley (full width)
    Is it his ability to accept dirty Kremlin money? His abilities at being a great father and husband? His ability to never have to work for anything honestly?

    In another life he's "honest" John the car dealer with a reputation for selling **** cars, and anything you could possibly want from the back of his 1988 Ford Sierra. Who spends at least 10 days a year in Family court.
     
  2. stairfoot.red

    stairfoot.red Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Oct 5, 2008
    Messages:
    2,876
    Likes Received:
    5,265
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    Computer Engineer
    Location:
    Stairfoot
    Style:
    Barnsley (full width)
    But in 2017 he was up against the most inept Tory election campaign ever it fell apart yet he still lost and then made himself look even more foolish in the eyes of the public by pretending that somehow the defeat was a victory. Corbyn was never going to be PM and the right thing to do for the party and the country would have been for him to walk away after 2017 and allow someone who was electable to take over however he clung on and proved those of us who said he was an electoral liability right and whose suffering because of his failure to do the right thing the very people him and his cult momentum claim they wanted to help. You only win elections in this country when youre a Labour leader by convincing the center ground of the electorate that your competent and will make their lives better too.
     
  3. tosh

    tosh Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Mar 20, 2008
    Messages:
    5,564
    Likes Received:
    2,541
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Occupation:
    Retired
    Location:
    North Sea
    Style:
    Barnsley Dark
    Surprised your asking
     
    Marlon likes this.
  4. MDG

    MDG Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 21, 2005
    Messages:
    4,937
    Likes Received:
    3,442
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    Darton
    Home Page:
    Style:
    Barnsley (full width)
    As soon as the pandemic broke around the world, it should have been treated differently. There should have been a cross party group setup and a national approach developed.

    Said the same with Brexit. Once we voted to leave, from day 1 should have been a cross party group to develop our future relationship whilst honouring the vote.

    Both events of such magnitude are not for one party to dictate on IMO.

    History will show I suspect no party having handled the brexit process well.

    As for covid, probably the same. I want Labour to clearly put on the table what their strategy would be ie to sort the track n trace out, balancing the R level without complete economic meltdown. All I have heard is criticism of how the Torys have handled it rather than a clear alternative pathway.

    If that had been on the table for the public to hear all these months, they would be streaks ahead in the polls at present but most have them level at best. I know polls have to be taken with a large pinch of salt these days but if Starmer had promoted his clear strategy, Johnsons position, especially with the Tory infighting would be really under the spotlight and these next 6 months could be the end of his tenure.

    OP, OK your view on Tory light get that but under the current voting system that IMO is the only way that Labour will return to power.

    Starmer should be pushing again for reform in our electoral process, whether that is PR or similar. Without that change, Tory light as it is labelled gives Starmer the strongest chance.
     
    Stephen Dawson likes this.
  5. JamDrop

    JamDrop Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Mar 30, 2013
    Messages:
    17,682
    Likes Received:
    17,693
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    Leeds
    Style:
    Barnsley (full width)
    Exactly. Corbyn was exactly what I wanted as Prime Minister but it was too good to be true. I then wanted Starmer to win the leadership contest as although he isn't everything I want him to be, I do think he has a very good chance of winning an election in a few years and I'll have to settle for that. I think he would disappoint me a lot in power but it's better to have someone like him than a Tory. Even absolute worse case he won't be a Boris Johnson so that's an improvement straight away.
     
  6. Fon

    Fonzie Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 18, 2012
    Messages:
    8,049
    Likes Received:
    13,319
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Style:
    Barnsley (full width)
    Don't forget racist.

    He likes a bit of that does Our Nudge.
     
  7. Dragon Tyke

    Dragon Tyke Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 9, 2011
    Messages:
    18,368
    Likes Received:
    5,550
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    Saint Athan
    Style:
    Barnsley (full width)
    it's what you do I guess..... does it warm your loins.:p
     
  8. YTB

    YTBFC Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Mar 8, 2020
    Messages:
    3,684
    Likes Received:
    14,783
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Style:
    Barnsley (full width)
    40% of the electorate voted for Corbyn in 2017. Whatever context or reasoning, that's a fact.

    Let's not forget either, for all the Blair love and his huge win in '97, it mustn't be forgotten that John Smith had a 23 point lead in the polls before his untimely death. The Tories were an absolute sitting duck. Fingers crossed, that's what this current lot are in a few years and Sir Keir sees them off.
     
  9. Redhelen

    Redhelen Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 29, 2018
    Messages:
    34,747
    Likes Received:
    40,744
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Female
    Style:
    Barnsley (full width)
    Just a point, the government has all of the civil service on hand to gather the information they need. The opposition isn't afforded that opportunity so coming up with an alternative strategy isnt as easy. However some mistakes and lies are so obvious we can all spot them!!
     
  10. TitusMagee

    TitusMagee Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 2, 2018
    Messages:
    8,599
    Likes Received:
    13,262
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Silkstone Common
    Style:
    Barnsley (full width)
    I will look forward to your next valuable contribution to the board.
     
  11. Dys

    Dyson Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 13, 2005
    Messages:
    13,822
    Likes Received:
    3,239
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    Tarn centre
    Home Page:
    Style:
    Barnsley (full width)
    It seems pretty obvious to me what he's doing. He's facing an idiot. He's giving that idiot enough rope to prove to those who voted for him that he's an idiot.

    When they've come to that conclusion, which many are now, then he wants to have been seen & heard saying the right things so that the idiots who voted for the idiot before will now vote for him.

    Idiots.

    Pragmatic power v principled opposition for me. Not student politics this. It's people's lives & a Conservative country (and let's not forget Scots/Wales grappling with nationalism that's reducing Lab vote further) is never gonna vote en mass for a Left Labour. Like he said today. F.ck the argument I want to win an election.
     
    Sheriff and churtonred like this.
  12. Hooky feller

    Hooky feller Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 11, 2016
    Messages:
    15,038
    Likes Received:
    17,099
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Occupation:
    Retired, full time grandad.
    Location:
    Mapp.
    Style:
    Barnsley (full width)
    If you watched Sunday it was quite clear.
    Yeah reight kicking. Couldn’t hold onto power. The labour movement was based on socialist principles. New labour stole the title.
     
    Last edited: Sep 22, 2020
  13. Dys

    Dyson Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 13, 2005
    Messages:
    13,822
    Likes Received:
    3,239
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    Tarn centre
    Home Page:
    Style:
    Barnsley (full width)
    The labour movement has delivered 30 years of government in a century. 13 of those 30 came under 'New Labour'.

    Steal that title all day if the next 'non Labour' government delivers minimum wage, EMA, better hospitals & better schools without even talking about working tax credits, sure starts etc.

    I class myself as a socialist btw.
     
    Sheriff and churtonred like this.
  14. BBB

    BBBFC Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 25, 2015
    Messages:
    731
    Likes Received:
    750
    Trophy Points:
    93
    Style:
    Barnsley (full width)
    Can't agree enough. I'd much rather have a centrist Labour than the Tories, even though I'd rather have a left-wing Labour overall. Get into power first.

    Those complaining that Starmer is Tory-lite are as bad as the Americans who refused to vote in 2016 because the Democrats nominated Clinton over Sanders, ultimately leading to Trump getting in.

    Let's get the Tories out and work from there.
     
    churtonred likes this.
  15. stairfoot.red

    stairfoot.red Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Oct 5, 2008
    Messages:
    2,876
    Likes Received:
    5,265
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    Computer Engineer
    Location:
    Stairfoot
    Style:
    Barnsley (full width)
    Blair couldn't hold onto power?????? he won 3 elections then stood down undefeated it was Brown who couldn't hold on to power by starting the move further left Milliband took it further then Corbyn further still. Even in the teeth of the fall out from the Iraq war Blair won an election Corbyn couldn't even win one when the Tory campaign imploded and May had a meltdown half way through.
     
    Sheriff and Stephen Dawson like this.
  16. pon

    pontyender Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 18, 2005
    Messages:
    10,717
    Likes Received:
    3,794
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    Barnsley
    Home Page:
    Style:
    Barnsley (full width)
    The last time Whitty came up with a figure, he grossly underestimated the death toll in the first wave.
     
    Stephen Dawson and Redhelen like this.
  17. Hooky feller

    Hooky feller Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 11, 2016
    Messages:
    15,038
    Likes Received:
    17,099
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Occupation:
    Retired, full time grandad.
    Location:
    Mapp.
    Style:
    Barnsley (full width)
    New labour appealed to the general public I get that. I was trying to point out the socialist party was indeed old labour. Not extreme left. Instead folk talk about socialism as though it’s communism. Why do socialists like you and me get labelled so.
     
  18. Hooky feller

    Hooky feller Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 11, 2016
    Messages:
    15,038
    Likes Received:
    17,099
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Occupation:
    Retired, full time grandad.
    Location:
    Mapp.
    Style:
    Barnsley (full width)
    50 Labour Achievements after 1997
    1. A rising National Minimum Wage - the annual uprating benefits 1 million
    people a year.
    2. TheshortestwaitingtimessinceNHSrecordsbegan.
    3. Three million more operations carried out each year than in 1997, with more
    than double the number of heart operations.
    4. Over44,000moredoctors
    5. Over89,000morenurses
    6. OverthreequartersofGPpracticesnowofferextendedopeninghoursfor
    at least one evening or weekend session a week.
    7. Allprescriptionsarenowfreeforpeoplebeingtreatedforcancerorthe
    effects of cancer, and teenage girls are offered a vaccination against
    cervical cancer.
    8. TheNHScannowguaranteethatyouwillseeacancerspecialistwithintwo
    weeks if your GP suspects you may have cancer. Whatever your condition,
    you will not have to wait more than 18 weeks from GP referral to the start of
    hospital treatment – and most waits are much shorter than this.
    9. 22millionpeoplearebenefitingfromrealtaxcutstoboosttheirincomethis
    year.
    10.12 million pensioners benefiting from increased Winter Fuel Payments
    11.900,000 pensioners lifted out of poverty
    12.500,000 children lifted out of relative poverty and measures already in train
    will lift around a further 500,000 children out of poverty.
    13.Free TV licences for over-75s
    14.The New Deal has helped over 2 million people into work
    15.Over 3 million Child Trust Funds have been started
    16.Nearly 3,000 Sure Start Children’s Centres opened, reaching 2 million
    children and their families

    17.Over 42,400 more teachers and 123,000 more teaching assistants than in
    1997
    18.There have been approximately 3,700 rebuilt and significantly refurbished
    schools; including new and improved classrooms, laboratories and kitchens.
    19.A free nursery place for every 3 and 4 year old.
    20.Doubled the number of registered childcare places to more than 1.5 million,
    one for every four children under eight years old
    21.More young people attending university than ever before
    22.More than doubled the number of apprenticeships starts, with figures for
    2008/9 showing 234,000 started an apprenticeship this year compared to
    75,000 in 1997.
    23.In 1997 more than half of all schools saw less that 30% of their pupils fail to
    get 5 good GCSEs including English and Maths. Now only 270 schools fail this
    benchmark and we are guaranteeing that no school should fail this mark
    after 2011.
    24.We have increased school funding to support the delivery of higher
    standards. Between 1997-98 and 2009-10, total funding per pupil has more
    than doubled from £3,030 in 1997-98 to £6,350 in 2009-10 in real terms, an
    increase of 110%
    25.The Northern Ireland peace process
    26.The UK is now smokefree, with no smoking in most enclosed public places.
    27.The UK’s greenhouse gas emissions are now 21% below 1990 levels, beating
    our Kyoto target.
    28.Over £20 billion invested in bringing social housing to decent standards
    29.Rough sleeping has dropped by two thirds and homelessness is at its lowest
    level since the early 1980s
    30.Free off-peak travel on buses anywhere in England for over-60s and disabled
    people
    31.Since 1997 overall crime is down 36 per cent; domestic burglary is down 54
    per cent; vehicle related crime is down 57 per cent; and violent crime is
    down 41 per cent.
    32.A new flexible points-based system to ensure only those economic migrants
    who have the skills our economy needs can come to work in the UK.
    33.Police numbers up by 16,000 since 1997, alongside more than 16,000 Police
    Community Support Officers
    34.Every community now has its own dedicated neighbourhood police team,
    easily contactable by the people who live in that community and working
    with them to agree local priorities and deal with people’s concerns.

    35.Equalised the age of consent and repealed Section 28.
    36.Through the introduction of civil partnerships, Labour has for the first time
    given legal recognition to same-sex partners. Gay couples now have the
    same inheritance, pension and next-of-kin rights as married couples.
    37.More than doubled Britain’s overseas aid budget. UK aid helps lift an
    estimated 3 million people out of poverty every year
    38.Cancelled up to 100 per cent of debt for the world’s poorest countries
    39.Britain now has more offshore wind capacity than any country in the world.
    Wind last year provided enough electricity to power 2 million homes
    40.Launched the £1.5 billion Housing Pledge to speed up the delivery of new
    affordable housing and embarked on the biggest program of council house
    building for twenty years
    41.Launched the Swimming Challenge Fund to support free swimming for over
    60s and under 16s
    42.Banned fox hunting.
    43.Led the campaign to win the 2012 Olympics for London. Today the
    programme remains on time and on budget with over 40% of the
    construction programme completed and all major venues under
    construction.
    44.Free admission to our national museums and galleries.
    45.Devolution in Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland, an elected Mayor and
    Assembly for London and directly-elected mayors for those cities that want
    them.
    46.Created a new right of pedestrian access to the English coast, so that every
    family has the opportunity to enjoy the length and breadth of our coastline
    47.In the last 4 years Labour’s work overseas has helped over 7 million people in
    sub-Saharan Africa access clean water and sanitation
    48.In Europe we signed the Social Chapter and introduced measures including:
    four weeks’ paid holiday; a right to parental leave; extended maternity
    leave; a new right to request flexible working; and the same protection for
    part-time workers as full-time workers.
    49.We led efforts to agree a new international convention banning all cluster
    munitions.
    50.We introduced the first ever British Armed Forces and Veterans Day to
    honour the achievements of our armed forces – both past and present.

    Tories claims of increasing the numbers of doctors and nurses for example. Only restored after their decimation of those like jobs when gaining power.
     
    upthecolliers likes this.
  19. pon

    pontyender Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 18, 2005
    Messages:
    10,717
    Likes Received:
    3,794
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    Barnsley
    Home Page:
    Style:
    Barnsley (full width)
    It's a very poor compromise. If they were making decisions purely on health, pubs and restaurants would be closed again. They daren't do that because it would be catastrophic for these jobs. I can't think why they haven't stopped households mixing full stop like Scotland though. These measures don't address half the mixing issues.
     
  20. Don

    Donny-Red Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 1, 2018
    Messages:
    5,766
    Likes Received:
    7,780
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    Style:
    Barnsley (full width)
    Or indeed Corbyn who spent his entire career working against the leadership ;)
     

Share This Page