The working class

course we all know the tories love the, nhs thatcther loved it so much she put waiting times up. the avoidable death rate under tories (in poorer areas only) was a disgrace labour did a brilliant job to bring it back from the dead we all know its never gonna be perfect but its a hell of a lot better under labour than its ever been under tories thats fact. so you can bring as many slurs as you want its facts that count.i suspect your father did better in hospital than in the tory era

 

i am affraid that your assumptions are inccorect

the NHS flew a specialist in from Canada to operate on my father in the thatcher era i guy called professor stell

I thank blairs NHS projewct because generally it improved ITsalaries across the UK, but achieved nothing for the NHS

under blairs they would sooner pay banksie to paint the ****ing hospital

 

that is an absolutely crass statement if they flew him in as you say then you are either well connected,lucky or didn't live in a poorer area or part privately funded.theres plenty of people in barnsley who did'nt get anyway near that care under the tories.and facts say that under tories avoidable deaths because they wouldn't fund the nhs was a disgrace.the nhs under blair was totally revamped this is a fact. you can keep rubbishing with your anecdotes as much as you want but facts state barnsley peoples health fares better under labour.

 

Lived ion Barnsley all my live and flow flew into liverpool and the operation was performed on the same day that leos burnt down

FACT FACT FACT

you hypothesis all you want i will talk in fact

 

What is the ........WORKING CLASS ???

In my experience in life its this.............it's how a person thinks

If a person more or less lives for today and spends for today then they are working class
If a person builds and plans for a better future for themselves and their family then they are middle class

So, you can get a dustbin man who is middle class........example, planning for a good education for his children
And you can get a top paid office worker that is very working class.........example, blowing all his/her money on cloths and a nice fast car

I consider myself very 'middle class'..........and I'm from a mining family that is also..........very middle class

 

Re: What is the ........WORKING CLASS ???

good point well made nudger

 

it may be fact about your dad but what about the REAL facts about the nhs which i've put to you and you keep choosing to ignore

 

Re: What is the ........WORKING CLASS ???

why did you use my statement to make that point never argued on that point at all,but as your here remember thatwhen on hard times

 

Re: What is the ........middle class

 

Re: What is the ........middle class

So after all the points about middle-class and working class are we to assume that its actually the NHS that is at stake and not class per se? If so then I think it is a political point about political parties and their role. For me I personally hate the Conservative Party but then again I don't have much liking for the Labour Party which wont even sympathise with public sector workers who are being hammered and having their pay and pensions cut through no fault of their own. If we go back to working-class and middle-class I dont really think the working-class have any friends in politics anymore.... I could rant on about the relative rise in the BNP vote...

 

Nudge, surpassed your self there

Quote Originally Posted by Young Nudger View Post
In my experience in life its this.............it's how a person thinks

''If a person more or less lives for today and spends for today then they are working class
If a person builds and plans for a better future for themselves and their family then they are middle class

So, you can get a dustbin man who is middle class........example, planning for a good education for his children
And you can get a top paid office worker that is very working class.........example, blowing all his/her money on cloths and a nice fast car

I consider myself very 'middle class'..........and I'm from a mining family that is also..........very middle class''
Nudge,
What does that make me, not bragging cos I consider myself lucky to have been in continuous employment since leaving school in 1964 with no qualifications in spite of Thatcher and her co-horts, But, at present I live in a 2000 sq ft dormer cottage (paid for ) surrounded by 6ft high stone walls, electric gates, retired at 56 years of age, I am now 62, put my son through uni twice, drive a nice car, have a nice life, all that on working my arse off as an hourly paid steel worker that planned for the future, and guess what, I am still a working class person with working class values, I hate every thing that the tories stand for cos I know that despite every thing I have worked for and achieved, if they could, they would take it off me tomorrow without a second thought because I am not of their class. Middle class miners,f uk off, no such thing, unless they are so pretentious to think cos they have a few bob they are. Nudge, class is class and until there is a serious change of direction in national thinking then it will always be so. England is a class riddled society. Being working class is something to be proud of, not something to despise and escape from. NUDGE YOU ARE A SNOB OF THE MOST DESPICABLE KIND. I don't expect a reply because I challenged you once before about the middle class miners statement and you didn't reply.

 

Christ . . . .

 

Like I tried to explain........its NOT how much you earn......its how you plan

I worked at the pit with contract tunnellers who were earning 3 times what I was earning
Not many of those contractors had anything to show for those high wages, both then and now

And class is nothing to do with how you vote.........I would say politics is more to do with history and traditions rather than class

 

You might well do Tyrone, but pleaase explain how allowing the GP's to "run" the NHS, invariably with a private company actually doing it for the and making profit where there was none before, just liek everything else that has been privatised, is supporting the workers of the NHS?

I cannot see how allowing so called competition will improve anything. Well, tell a lie it will improve the bottom line of the for profit health firms suddenly popping up.

As a previous poster has said, the NHS as we know it, is dead. It will not be long before you have to pay to see a GP and then pay to top up for treament.

Do you think that the NHS can be managed solely by Doctors and Nurses? If so, who will actually care for the patients?

 

Example..........two weeks ago I went to my uncle's 90th birthday party

My uncle was a railway worker.
At that time railway workers were earning far less than miners. That is to say, while he was bringing his family up he was relatively poor.
He lived in Bolton upon Dearne and had two children
He sent those kids from Bolton to the top schools in Sheffield.
Every day those kids had long journeys on trains and buses back and forth from school.
Those two kids became a teacher and a headmaster. Between them they had 3 children. These children now:
One works for the BBC in Belfast.
One is a consultant pediatrician
One is a general practitioner.

My uncle, the railway worker............is middle class

 

Re: Example..........two weeks ago I went to my uncle's 90th birthday party

No, his children may be middle class but he is working class.

I work in IT, programming and database administration. What could be considered a middle class job I guess but it's all aout perception. Things have shifted so there is less blue collar work and more people find them selves in traditionally middle class jos. But I still consider myself to be working class.

 

Re: Example..........two weeks ago I went to my uncle's 90th birthday party

i always thought working class is anyone that has to work for a living ? hence working class, so what i dont understand is how you become middle class.

how do you make that step and what makes it then classed as middle

 

Working Class - Football & Rugby League
Middle Class - Rugby Union & Tennis
Upper Class - Horse events and shooting game
Under Class - Wearing Sportswear

 

Very good!

 

No......his line of thinking has been continued by his chidren and his grand children

............that is to say..........they all think the same way.........they are all middle class
It dosen't matter that one of them worked on the railways and had little or no money