Giving a Manager time

I was reading an interview with Alex Ferguson the other day and he talked about the need for patience from supporters and Board when a new manager is appointed to a club.

Reading some of the comments on here about Lee Johnson prompted me to look back at Danny Wilson's first spell as Barnsley manager. His record in his first full season as our manager was good and we finished sixth (that year the sixth placed team did not get into the play-offs) and his initial 23 league games produced a record of 11 wins, 5 draws and 7 losses. Lee Johnson's record over the same number of games is 9 wins, 7 draws and 7 losses so not too dissimilar.

Danny went on in his second season to have us finish 10th so that was disappointing but I don't remember anyone calling for his head and people could see that he was building a proper team who played for each other. No "big time billies" he used to say. In his third season we went on to get promotion to the Premier League. He was given time.

Danny Wilson came to us from Sheffield Wednesday so imagine what the keyboard warriors on here would be saying in that second season if we had the internet in those days.

In my view we have appointed a fine young manager who is going to be successful. I hope that success will be with us and not elsewhere. He has brought in some fine young players from top clubs and this suggests to me that the managers of those clubs see him as someone to trust with their best young ones. I think we supporters should start showing him the same trust.

I have sat in the same seat at Oakwell for almost 20 years and I never hear any of the sort of negativity I read on here from those who sit around me (and most of them have been there for the same period). They moan and groan when things aren't going well but they understand the need to look medium to long term and don't over react in the way that some on here do. If they had their way we would be changing the manager every other week.

Onwards and upwards.

 

I think a Manager needs at least 3 years to build a strong team to challenge for titles

 

Excellent post. Sadly, I'm afraid you'll find that lots of folk on here will say that Johnson should be producing better results than Danny's first spell because we're in a lower league. It's utter tosh of course because the circumstances have altered no end in 20 years. We are where we are so success is relative. But making comparisons between managers records in different divisions appears to be a no-no on here. Trust me.

http://bbs.barnsleyfc.org.uk/showthread.php?232474-Statistically-Speaking

 

Excellent post, just one point regarding sitting in the same seat for 20 years...haven't you got a home to go to?

 

I enjoyed watching those Wilson teams in 94/95 & 95/96 playing nice attractive, attacking football and getting a lot of plaudits for it.

 

Those teams played fast vibrant attacking football fron the off. The season before Danny took over when Viv was in charge we narrowly missed relegation. Finishing 6th in his first season was a fantastic achievement. Finishing 10th in his second season given our budget was pretty fantastic so we aren't exactly comparing apples with apples. Doesn't mean I don't agree with your general points about giving managers time but not a good comparator. Maybe someone like Machin would be a better yardstick.

 

Think you'll find the majority are complaining about the lack of entertainment not the results and its a minute number calling for another change. Even the most vociferous are advocating sticking with the current manager.

 

There's been no calls for the managers head on here, nothing even close to resembling it. Not that I've seen. There has however been much said this season on the standard of our football, it appears that the vast majority on here aren't very excited, nor keen on the football served up so far by LJ. And that's about it. Nothing else to see.


But to the OP, can I make the simple observation, and just point out you'd have been much better off comparing LJ's first 23 league games in charge of BFC at this level, with Danny Wilson's first 23 league games in charge of BFC at this level. It reads like this:


LJ: 9 wins, 7 draws, 7 defeats (34 pts)

DW: 8 wins, 5 draws, 10 defeats (29 pts)


Much fairer comparison. And more favourable for LJ.

However, you've to factor in that LJ's most successful players since he's been here are lads DW signed. Because, yes, amazing innit, DW was sacked far too soon. So I'll end by saying that the fans don't need to do anything. It's nothing to do with us (just a hundred or so wallies posting on a forum) how long a manager lasts. You need to aim such points at the club/board who select these managers. In my opinion (all of the above is).

As always though with your threads, pal, enjoyable. You shouldn't be quiet and should post more often.

 

Just a shame that his second spell didn't bear the same philosophy

 

Dont think anybody is expecting to see the finished article yet but LJ has been here long enough now to see some significant improvements to be being shown on a regular basis. The football for the most part has been dire and his management has cost us numerous points. I was never quite sure why he was appointed and I'm still waiting to be shown and as I've said before, you have to give time to the right man, not just anyone.

Unless performances (not results particularly) start to become better more consistently soon I think he should be looking over his shoulder.


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You don't mind a manager making mistakes, good god we all do in life, but when the same mistakes are repeated then alarm bells start ringing.

As regards to his appointment he ripped up the league at Oldham if i remember rightly didn't he?

The old brain cells arnt what they were, I feel a self prescription coming on

 

And yet, it's the same supporters who say Mark Robins is the best manager we've had in recent years. Despite the fact that he was also heavily reliant on loanees and the quality of football in my opinion was much worse.

It's a results business first and foremost; I think I'd take winning ugly over losing gracefully every day of the week personally.

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It was a shame.

 

Except the football under Robins was nowhere close to being as boring as it is now. Robins was also operating at a level where we wernt one of the bigger clubs with the budget to match and players wernt drawn to coming to us, so he made us a compact side who were hard to break down but who also had 3/4 players who could hurt the opposition. Im sure had we of had millions to spend we'd have been a lot more fluent.

The difference between Robins and LJ is that Robins adapted to the situation to get the best out of what he had available, LJ expects every **** to adapt to his defensive, negative tactics albeit at the expense of the good of the team.


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