Religion of peace at it again

That is one of the aims of ISIS, to isolate peaceful Muslims, and draw them nearer to their cause.

 

Lots of 'good press' about Muslims. Depends where you look. You won't see much on Sky News though. Doesn't fit their narrative or agenda.

End of the day, innocent folk have again perished at the hands of evil folk.

 

This is absolutely true. But hand on heart, do you believe they'd have gone and done it (and taken themselves with their victims into the bargain) in an atheistic world? I don't. This is not me being Islamophobic, it's what I genuinely believe. The same as all the Catholic nutcases who genuinely believe that contraception (and all the myriad of associated health benefits) is wrong. That dogma alone must have accounted for more deaths through AIDS in Africa than all the terrorist attacks in the world combined by a factor of ten. But the worrying thing is that a lot of the people who genuinely believe that are not actually loonies. Some of my relatives are a case in point. Uber intelligent university educated professionals, including a NASA scientist FFS, all of whom live by Catholic doctrines, despite the fact that rationally they must know that it makes absolutely no sense.

 

Bang on.

 

Most evil people blame something. God told me to do it is usually a favourite. It was Peter Sutcliffe's reasoning wasn't it? When someone does summat good they thank God. You're talking about something that has been a part of humanity since forever - religion. It helped - I'm guessing - early civilizations make sense of the world. Science has answered so many of the big questions since then, and in most developed countries you will have noticed that any form of worship is slowly decreasing. As I said in my other post, I was Christened, I go to church at Easter and Christmas. But that's about it. I do so to sit in peace and reflect, and mainly to think of those I've lost. I believe I'll one day see these people again. But that's where my religious values end. You'd have to be proper open minded to read either the Bible and Koran and actually accept the majority of their content. There's a website somewhere that compares both, side by side. They have practically the same messages, or have used the same messages but for different ends. You're talking about ancient texts that have been translated so many times, doctored no doubt to fit agendas and so much of what's contained within them is so far removed from the modern world. I was an 80's child and to be homosexual was wrong I was told. As was the notion of changing your gender. Fast forward 30 years and homosexuality is accepted in most developed countries. Gay marriage is an actual right. You can have a sex change. Look at America. Only 60 or so years ago that black people were segregated in what is now seen as the biggest/best country in the world.

Things change. I've no problems with any of that. I can happily interact and socialize with any person I get along with, no matter their colour or religious beliefs. I will never tell someone else they can't do what they want. I'm not the law. And so how can I be a proper Christian or Muslim or Hindu, whatever? When my lifestyle, my brain can't agree with all facets of it?

Most of the Muslim lads I get on with at work are the lads born here. They smoke, drink, some don't even fast at Ramadan. They've been westernized. Give it another 50/60 years and there'll be very few devout muslims here. It's the elders here right now who are devout and still have that ability to make youngsters tow the line. But when they're gone, as I say I predict a different time. A change. As will always happen.


So I'm in agreement with you in essence. I can't get my head around any intelligent person blindly following a religion. But they do. I know many. Friends of mine even. It doesn't affect me and so good luck to them. But in turn, they don't tell me my way of doing Christianity is wrong. Because it's not wrong to me. But the devout religious folk I know, they're some of the nicest folk I've ever met. The Muslim lads at work are so peaceful. I'm a right wally, I take the piss out of them constantly, in a nice way. They give it back. It's taken time to get to that point like. As it does with any relationship formed.

I'll counter that by saying my closest friends, my best pals and my missus and family, none of them are what I'd call proper religious, like me I suppose. And they too are great and lovely folk. It's the evil folk I've an issue with. Like those who've committed suicide today (a sin) to kill others (a sin) in the hope of martyrdom (not an option). So aye, religion can feed evil. But when these things happen like today, the first thought I have is "**** sake, how awful for those involved" etc. Which is why I posted what I did at the start. In response to other people's first thought being - ******* religion.


Hope some of that makes sense. Tricky topic to make sense of though.

 

The thing I find absolutely fascinating about religions other than the evil done in their name is the fact that the adherents don't identify themselves as cult members. Some cults are more successful than others so there are more Catholics than people who believe in David Icke's lizard man theories but at heart they are one and the same. It's always something that has intrigued me.

 

Thanks for taking the time to post such a thoughtful response comrade, I enjoyed reading that.

 

No bother. It's nice to have reasoned discussion/debate. Think on, [MENTION=7244]bossman[/MENTION]

 

Knob off you twonk :-D

 

By the way I drove past Mr Morrisons head office in Bradford earlier, it's a pretty impressive building

 

Why is it not possible to abhor a religion without being accused of being racist..

I loathe and detest the Muslim faith as I do most religions which are mired in 14th century ideology and outdated rituals and dogmas.
HOWEVER, that never stopped me working with, and having friends with different beliefs. It is perfectly possible to separate most people from their religious views when choosing friends unless their extreme religious views spill over into their every day lives.

The difficulty for some is they automatically link cultural differences with religion e.g. inequality in the treatment of women may be re-enforced by the Islamic faith but it is not the cause. That stems from an outdated culture and societal viewpoint. It is not that long ago (late 19th century) that married women in Britain were regarded as chattels, their possession became the husband's when they married, they could lawfully be beaten by their husbands and they did not even have the right to vote until the 20th century. They could not obtain degrees or study as doctors. Most simply accepted that as how it was and it took a small but growing band of strong minded women who gradually brought about change. Even now in some areas, women are treated (or at least viewed) as second class. Even for a couple of decades after WW2 the accepted status of women was to be the homemaker and child bearer whilst the 'man of the house' went out to work. It was not until the Early mid '60s when birth control came along that women found their voice.

Change can only come about from within. The West by trying to impose its culture and societal values on the East is a large part of why we are where we are. The fanatics who misinterpret the Koran in thinking it directs all Muslims to fight a holy war to make the whole world Islamic are the minority as were the Crusaders who slaughtered and maimed Muslims and sacked Jerusalem in the name of Christianity.

Religion and Nationalism ..... pah!!

 

It is indeed. It houses all the wallies who get paid loadsa money while we do the graft.

 

Re: Why is it not possible to abhor a religion without being accused of being racist.

Agree with most of that. Just the loathing really that I don't share.

 

Thing is its not just Is in the news recently is it?

 

I don't think any "Intelligent " person does follow religion blindly. It depends how you define intelligence.

The ability to reason is the trues sign of intelligence. Reason then raises doubts. Free thinkers like Einstein, and many scientists become religious as they realise the more they discover the less they know and then rationalise there must be more to 'it' than they can explain. hence they 'get' religion.

Show me a person who is 100% certain and unwavering in their belief and I will show you a fool. Doubt is what breeds faith. I am agnostic because I simply don't know. One part of me WANTS to believe there is more to life and the s*its of this world get their come uppance afterwards and those who are good get their reward but I have a nagging doubt that when we die it is like turning off a computer for the last time and ..err.. that is it. Who really knows?

i say this because it explains (in my little brain at least) how well 'qualified', supposedly intelligent can turn into terrorists. Many come from jobs where a good memory and steady hands are sufficient to be 'good at the job'.....Doctors, IT workers etc. You don't need much imagination or innovative reasoning skills for many of those types of job.

 

Talking of cults, have you seen or read anything of note about scientology? Absolutely loop the loop.

 

I tried to shag one once she was well fit so I thought I could fake some empathy on the off chance of getting into her knickers. Mitsubishi's have a lot to answer for...

Needless to say when I realised how barking their beliefs are I legged it.

 

Sadly it is to do with religion, perpetrated by evil misguided gits but in the name of religion none the less. History is full of atrocities carried in the name of it!