The 'democratic' way out of this mess

Discussion in 'Bulletin Board ARCHIVE' started by Orsen Kaht, Jun 27, 2016.

  1. Ors

    Orsen Kaht Guest

    It's clear that about 75% of the current Parliament are totally against the collective act of self-harm visited on the country last Thursday. The campaigns for a second referendum are well meaning, but unrealistic. Given that we went into the common market/EU via an act of parliament it's fairly clear that the doctrine of the sovereignty of parliament requires a similar act of the legislature to take us out. So the activation of Article 50 of the Lisbon Treaty which triggers that process is arguably not in the gift of this or any prime minister. Given that we are to have a new prime minister, there is a growing argument to say that he or she should seek a fresh mandate by calling a general election.That would obviously have to be after having sought parliament's agreement to amending the Fixed Term Parliaments Act 2011. It's fairly obvious that every candidate in the general election would want to state their position on the implementation of the decision of the in/out referendum. If the candidates returned are still overwhelmingly of the 'remain' persuasion then there is a democratic mandate to not implement it, or at least to implement it in a way which minimises it's most harmful effects, i.e. by retaining freedom of movement and membership of the single market. Problem solved (democratically).
     
  2. manxtyke

    manxtyke Well-Known Member

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    Er no
    its been 4 days including sat and sun its not a mess give it time, go about your daily business,and stop being a drama queen
     
  3. Shy Talk

    Shy Talk Well-Known Member

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    ....is to sack Hodgson

    Sent from my SM-G900F using Tapatalk
     
  4. Ors

    Orsen Kaht Guest

    Er, it's Boris that's looking for a way not to implement it!
     
  5. manxtyke

    manxtyke Well-Known Member

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    Well hes a knob as well
    hth
     
  6. Ors

    Orsen Kaht Guest

    Are you thereev in disguise?
     
  7. Ors

    Orsen Kaht Guest

    Right, so now the football's finished let's have a look whether it's a "mess" or not.

    Sterling has fallen 14% since the polls closed and is at a 30 year low.
    The FTSE 100 fell 3% yesterday alone and the FTSE 250 by 7%.
    Trading in Barclays and RBS shares had to be suspended yesterday due to the falls in their share prices.
    The prime minister is now in 'lame duck' territory and will remain so until September.
    The prime minister will not implement Article 50, which is infuriating our EU partners and frustrating Brexit voters.
    There are signs of Tory infighting over his successor.
    The preferred Brexit candidate for Tory leader is already resiling from what was promised to voters (see his Telegraph article yesterday).
    The Labour party is in turmoil with the parliamentary party becoming more and more detached from the membership. A prolonged struggle for control is developing.
    The government will not trigger Article 50 until there have been preliminary talks - the EU will not talk until Article 50 is triggered.
    The level of racist assaults and incidents has reportedly risen by 57% since polling day.

    Perhaps I make the mistake of thinking your comments are even halfway serious, but if not, I hope we never get to the situation where you concede there IS a mess.

    Any right thinking person can see that the result of the referendum can not stand unaltered. I think that you'll find that parliament, the 'establishment' and even the incoming Boris will be looking for ways to water it down.
     
  8. Ors

    Orsen Kaht Guest

    And I forgot the breakup of the UK and the loss of our 'AAA' credit rating (which affacts the cost of our public borrowing). But no mess!
     
  9. manxtyke

    manxtyke Well-Known Member

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    No lad no mess the political system and party's need a good shake up they are all well out of touch with a least half the country. And the banks didn't give a flying **** about us when they crashed the system did they carried on in their own little world . Big shake up needed no mess just a good clear out. Btw I don't agree with racial assaults what so ever
     
  10. manxtyke

    manxtyke Well-Known Member

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    Oh and if they didn't expect a leave vote or at least have a plan for it they shouldn't be running the country anyway
     
  11. Farnham_Red

    Farnham_Red Administrator Staff Member Admin

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    Thats the thing I find staggering - neither the Cabinet and PM who are running the the country had any plan for a leave vote
    and even more amazing the official leave campain had no plan either. It seems it was assumed on all sides that Remain would win and so when Leave won chaos has ensued. Thats just unforgivable. I bet the scots had a plan for if they had won their referendum on independance.
    At the risk of sounding like a broken record thats my biggest problem with the referendum, it wasnt clear what the leave plan was - Id be much less upset if it was clear what had been voted for - but now it seems they are winging it and making it up as they go along

    Incompetence is too mild a word for it. And we now need to rely on these clowns to secure a good divorce deal from Junckers and his team who I bet have a much better idea of what they want to achieve. And to make it extra special the opposition is too busy imploding to step up and do what it was elected to do - words fail
     
  12. Red

    Red-Taff. Well-Known Member

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    Even if Johnson, Gove et al had a brilliant exit plan they couldn't do anything about because they have no authority to implement it.

    The one who has let us down is Cameron who has ducked out of his responsibility - as PM he should respect and respond to the referendum result and set the Exit process going.
     
  13. Ext

    Extremely Northern Well-Known Member

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    In a nutshell.
     
  14. Ors

    Orsen Kaht Guest

    He can't do it. It requires a vote of Parliament as a whole.
     
  15. MDG

    MDG Well-Known Member

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    Sums it up.. Majority voted out democratically, so trigger the Article 50.. Meanwhile the losing remain campaigners heaping more damage onto the economy by re-run requests, or ignoring the majority of the UK, yet everyone just blames the vote to leave, ridiculous to suggest this political whining is not impacting more. Just because he backed the wrong horse he's taken his bat n ball home.
     
  16. Red

    Red-Taff. Well-Known Member

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    totally agree.
    Can't think of another way of putting it - Cameron has fkd up big time -
     

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