Have you changed your mind about Brexit?

Can you give me actual examples of UK negotiators' arrogance? The EU negotiators reject virtually all of the UK's proposals, and give the impression that whilst we are willing to negotiate, the EU representatives are not.

Excuse my ignorance, but what does FIFY stand for?

 

Why should the EU give away what has been negotiated fir members only ?
This was always going to be the get out clause for the leading Brexiteers anyway.
Leaving the EU was always gonna be with great losses but the Brexiteers were always gonna use the arrogant EU card anyway to deflect the blame they have caused just as they have done with the immigration issue

 

It is interesting that small/ medium U.K. businesses are for Brexit and yet all the multi-nationals, the establishment and the media in general are against.

 

That’s a biased assumption without any proof isn’t it ?
I’d say small/medium businesses that trade in Europe will mostly be for .

 

I have heard small/medium sized business owners interviewed who trade with the EU also want to be able to trade with the growing markets outside the EU.

 

It would be very interesting if it were true. Businesses are owned by people and, as in every other case, there's going to be a split. I'd say that a small majority of business owners I know personally, including myself, strongly favour remain.

In my specific industry, on the other hand, I'm confident that it would be a very large majority indeed.

 

Not conclusive, but a survey in the Wiltshire area showed ~70% of businesses of all sizes that responded wanted to stay in the EU, and this was in an area with similar leave vote to Barnsley (60%+).

 

Only thing stopping them is themselves.

 

Well, for starters the current Chequers Proposal that is in breach of several of the EU rules so was always going to be rejected before it was even sent to the EU.
Going behind the backs of the EU negotiators to try to deal with the heads of state separately
"It'll be the easiest trade deal in the world" Liam Fox (nearly two years later and nowhere near)
"It'll be the row of the summer" David Davies (before caving in on the first day)
They need us more than we need them, etc, etc.


FIFY is Fixed It For You (Something FTFY = Fixed That For You)

 

Ask an Australian or Canadian why they wanted out of the British Empire?

Ultimately a small government will be more accountable than a large one. Would people wanting to be part of the EU be equally as happy to be the 51st state of America? The economic arguments are just as powerful.

 

You don't hear much outside the fringe about people wanting to secede from the USA, or Canada for that matter. But that is a different matter to actually wanting to join as the 52nd state (Puerto Rico would beat us to it). Would I be happy to live in a state of a country with easy availability to guns, high crime rates, and relatively poor education and health care?

 

Some Australians some Canadians you mean?
A small Governnent would be steamrollered with the big American companies who until the EU treaties treat infividual govts like dirt . With things they couldn’t get away with in the US .
Just watch our health service and food standards cave in with uk trade deals with the US etc. Of course Brexiteers will be championing the deals as good for us even though they’re not

 

I regular network with businesses of varying sizes. Of the several thousand I've engaged with, predominantly southern with about 15% in the north, the vast majority of SME's don't want Brexit.

Those that do have benefitted from a fall in sterling to export, but largely to EU countries, which upon exit may see a more turbulent time.

There are several big businesses who want an exit from the EU, so its a bit of a sweeping statement to paint that picture.

 

I can understand the perception that this big nasty imperialistic beast called the EU that's been pushed by the far right media for decades, is devouring Britain. In part there can be a little truth, but the vast majority of what we do is decided by British politicians.

If we also consider this. Let's turn it around, shoe other foot. What if Britain was an empire still and had extended a free trade economic model through it which we controlled from Westminster and shared cost of membership throughout the countries who were part of the Empire. What if, I dunno… New Zealand came along and said, hmm, we're interested in this model, we want to do free trade, and we want to access your systems and memberships, but we don't want to have to pay for it, or have Brits coming here as we've just too many and its diluting the maori culture. We still want to sell you Lamb and we'll not buy any of yours. We want access to all of your security information, ownership of everything created in the Empire, but we're not willing to accept any limitations.

Would the british people, the right wing press, and the public at large, tell New Zealand to go and do one? I suspect we would.

Judging by the british tub thumping as part of a Scottish in/out referendum, it's al the more amusing the double standards that are applied.

Because the EU have the temerity to actually ask us for a plan to negotiate against (its taken a year and a half to have a convoluted fudge of a botched white paper put together), and when we put it forward, they highlight how it won't work, how are the EU the villain in this?

We can't have a better deal with the Eu than we currently have. That's just common sense. Its so much common sense it staggers me how anyone can hold a counter position. Yes, perceive leaving the EU opens other doors, but surely accept that having any relationship with the EU, and it makes sense to as they are our biggest and nearest ally, is going to diminish from leaving it.

If you're a season ticket holder at oakwell, then not renew, do you expect to have access to the same seat, whenever you want, at a huge discount? Obviously not.

I'm not a fan of Theresa May at all. And she has found the circle to square impossible. Its very difficult to make a decision and carry it through knowing full well you're adversely affecting the security, mobility, opportunity and prosperity of every man woman and child in this country for a generation. We may well benefit long term, though I doubt that personally, but it will take us decades to get structures, deals, contracts and departments in place to not only replicate the positive things the Eu has done for us, but the so called betterment that is being sought in a post EU world.

 

Until the EU shift from being completely centric to Germany with a little France thrown in to keep them onside, it is doomed to failure, contstant failure from countries who cannot match up on an economic basis, more and more bailouts as the EU adopt even more centralised budgetary control over their member states until they finally become the United States of Europe...

Unemployment rates are a good yardstick. Look at a few of the EU Member states with their Germany first approach :-

Germany 3.5%
Portugal 7.9%
Greece 20.8%
Italy 10.9%
Ireland 6.1%
Croatia 9.6%
Spain 16.1%
Belgium 6.4%
France 8.9%

We have a magical opportunity to shape our own destiny whilst this European project begins to crumble as they try and force more and more Europe on each member state. Brexit is just the start of a slow falling domino effect, once we leave and they all need to contribute more, start to feel the squeeze, we'll soon see another country decide to call it a day. That will then increase the speed of the domino effect...

I'm thinking it will either be Portugal or Italy out of the door next. So get ready for #PREXIT or #ITEXIT...

Be a decent bet at the bookies for another country to announce a referendum or announce leaving by 2025.

 

Of course, you could also wonder on the impact on the UK. Leaving and an awful relationship with hard recession would fuel a Scottish departure from the Union. What will happen to Ireland if we cant find a solution between north and south. Could an unthinkable war be resurrected? Large companies could offshore more workers and hold token UK offices, leading to vast drops in tax take and revenue into HMRC, while still being hugely indebted, with no means of borrowing, and if our finances are downgraded by Moodys, Poors et al, we could see interest rate rises against our debt.

If exit is particularly bad and the more likely to worst predictions do come true, we may even find ourselves talking to the IMF to help us.

 

You might have thought they were telling lies on both sides - but they wernt really.
And that’s because there is NOT ONE single person in the world that understands what Brexit means.
The subject is so complexed.
Both sides were guessing during the election.
Even in the business I’m in that relies heavily on EU wildlife directives - there are so many ifs and buts no one knows what Brexit will mean.

 

The thread was about a the question of have you changed your mind over Brexit using the pole , it does not ask why anyone voted the way they did . It was a simple question to which I gave a simple reply , so to imply that I did not know why I voted the way I did, is bizarre.

 

One reason why we will get a GOOD free trade deal on many important goods and services is simply the balance and what the EU has to lose in not offering us such. I for one voting leave never expected to keep exactly the same benefits as the EU, but willing to trade off some of these to open the door to the wider developing markets. Ok so we may end up with paying into some form of pots to maintain a free trade deal at a business point of use, that has to be expected.

For those who think the EU will risk a no deal..

• UK has a goods trade deficit to the EU to the point of approx £95 billion per year, only countered with a surplus of £28 billion in services. That quite simply equates to the UK having an overall deficit of £67 billion per year in trading with the EU. It is clear to see who will be hurt the most should we not be given a comprehensive free trade deal.

Add on to that the UK's yearly contributions based on the ONS updated figure of £234 million per week after our rebate..They are not going to let us walk away without a good mutual deal.

People listening to the media too much from both perspectives rather than looking at hard fact. It is in our mutual interest to strike a good deal, probably more EU's favour accepted for access to their member states markets. I don't accept this cliff edge picture painted by the pro-remain media including the BBC, Sky.. I also do not accept the pro-leave extreme media saying walk away and offer nothing. That scenario is good for neither us or the EU.

In short, talk like adults, strike out a deal, get on with things and we will be fine. We just need a government who can deliver decent internal growth policies, increase our trade options around the world, kickstart more manufacturing options in the UK to compliment our world leading service markets. Can the Tories or Labour offer that.... mmmm another question but that's where the people of this country should be focusing their attention, not on crying about leaving the EU or trying to pull the drawbridge up..

It's really not rocket science, just being fair and open minded to change.

 

That’s part of the problem though isn’t it?
Brexiteers keep banging on about how much we mean to EU trade etc etc they can’t do without us etc etc . So they gonna lerrus is carry on as normal . Keep marching us to the cliff edge nothing will happen , yer right .