Have you changed your mind about Brexit?

I am being fair, you are unable to ascertain the education of the voting masses by using small polls. This has been no more apparent than in the last general election. If you want to try and find the higher ground, go for it. But this is typical of the “my opinion means more than yours” in this divisive subject.

You are using the same polls to ascertain the age of voters. There was nowhere on the voting slip that asked for age or level of education. So, as with the exit polls, are just pie in the sky.

And even if we do go with this theory of “educated”. What are they using for this? Education takes many forms... including lifelong experience., which it appears from your polls that people who voted brexit had in abundance.

So once again it comes down to the my dad’s bigger than your dad, so my opinion matters most. No it doesn’t. The opinions differ, no one is sure of the outcome. But to imply that one side is better than the other is simply not constructive.

 

Agreed, it was interesting that if you look at the business owners rolled out to champion a side before the vote everyone was on the side for what suited their business, eg Richard Branson, Alan Sugar were for remain, Chairman for JCB was for leave.
In case anyone is not aware how this affects them is RB,AS rely on imports, JCB rely on exports.

 

https://www.theguardian.com/politic...un/23/eu-referendum-live-results-and-analysis

Glad you agree the referendum was a small poll! National results show correlations between highest level of education and remain votes, higher salary and remain votes and higher number of migrants on an area and remain votes. The converse correlation also applies for lower education, lower wages and fewer migrants.

These are facts. I posited a theory that those who supported remain on here were more likely to follow the national trends.

 

Glad I agree that it was a small poll?!? I’m glad you can read a statement and misconstrue it so equivocally.

The polls on the back of the referendum aren’t facts. They are a slice of the voters. If you call these “facts”, other facts that should have happened are... labour would be in power, Donald trump wouldn’t, and the country would be remaining in Europe. To take a guardian poll as fact is also a little naive.

I posited a my theory to why your theory could be just that. And also why it does little to help the situation. And is merely like a playground taunt.

 

You are spot on as to why the EU are making it difficult to leave,they are indeed scared to death that others will follow suit,i've stated several times that as i travel around europe,particularly the more remote parts its inevitable we get asked about brexit and the general feeling i get is that most countries are as divided as us,if anything i'd hazard a guess that in my poll of a couple of dozen individuals,many of them a bit thick and poorly educated then they would be following us and be cutting ties with Junker and co.The way the EU is handling this shows them for what they are IMO,they are nothing more than power mad individuals living out their own ideology and raking it in in the process.The political union was forced upon us,if the common market had remained just that then there wouldnt be this debate and there wouldnt have been a referendum,but no,they wanted to take more and more control over our lives,its a governing body that nobody asked for ,its a governing body that we dont need and it is a million miles away from the proposal given in the 70's,its also beyond me how any democrat could be happy with it.
As for this rubbish about better educated,FFS,really??? its utter tripe,i'm educated to HNC and HND level in mining engineering and legislation,you cant get much higher than that other than doing the mining chartered engineers course(which we never got the chance to do) and i voted leave,I know doctors who voted leave,I also know plenty of businessmen that voted leave,these polls are nothing more than just that,polls,questioning 1000 people and using that as a basis for debate is ridiculous,the vote was cast and was in favour of leave,yes there was only a 4% difference,but that equated to 1,700,000 of the voters who bothered to take part, which imo is substantial enough,those that couldnt be arsed to get up of the settee have no say in the matter now,they should have cast their vote accordingly.
Like you tilertoes I see the EU as a failure and at sometime in the future the who carry on will be a shadow of what it is now.

 

I think he’s saying that if you look at the make up of people in each area then the areas that voted leave are mostly made up of minimum wage, less educated people whereas areas that voted remain have more highly educated and higher paid people there. Nothing to do with polls. Obviously there’ll be a mixture of all people in all areas and different votes in each area but that was the general trend.

 

http://www.medialens.org/index.php/...uardian-and-the-defrauded-british-public.html

That's the problem with the guardian , it's owned by a subsidiary of HSBC and its biggest revenue driver is ad revenue from yep , you ve guessed it HSBC and its clients . Had to use a different search engine other than Google to pull that story out . These large corporations are very clever at pushing real news further on down search results .

 

being higher educated and enjoying higher salaries does not make you any more able to make a judgment on the european union,many voted on what their life experiences were not because they were on minimum wage or they'd only got a CSE in woodwork.That chap who was on question time when they were in this neck of the woods said 'i know you all think we are thick up north',well he got it slightly wrong,even some northerners are making the same assumptions,it really is pathetic and an insult to the voters.Would these better educated folk be of the same opinion if these thick northerners returned a labour government at the next election?? no fcukin thought not.

 

To be fair, Trump lost the popular vote by 3 million or so.

You complain that using fact based reasoning is a schoolyard taunt. The fact is that the population of Barnsley in general is lesser educated than the population of Oxford or Bristol (for example). The is due to the lack of higher educational establishments in the area and the lack of higher paid graduate job opportunities. This does not say that an individual is unintelligent. I don't know you or your level of educational attainment. You could have left school at 14 or have a double PhD in quantum entanglement and be studying string theory and supersymmetry in your basement.

Barnsley and Doncaster voted leave strongly. Oxford and Bristol voted remain strongly. Please explain why you think the vote was so different between these areas? Both Oxford and Bristol are not Tory seats, but are surrounded by Tory strongholds.

Strong labour areas like Liverpool, Bristol, Manchester, Glasgow are Remain areas, but those Labour-voting areas with less migration, lower education and lower wages are leave.

 

So we agree that we do not know the make up of voters, but can speculate about each region.

 

Fact based are not facts. I could make other facts fit the theory too. There are no facts. Your implication is that people who voted leave were not intelligent. Thus opening up the debate to a slanging match. Neither side is more stupid than the other. However both sides have elements of stupidity.

And as I said, education takes many forms and it doesn’t always follow that you are able to predict the next step in this Euro debacle if you have a PhD in pop music or indeed string theory and super symmetry.

 

Reasonable weighted sample size of how many? From where in the country? Remember there were 34 million people who voted, im expecting a good chunk of that from a wide spread of areas and professions all who have answered truthfully......

Also YouGov.... I believe them!

So saying I do believe these “Facts” older wiser people voted leave younger not so wise voted remain? Can you see my point? It’s all irrelevant trying to belittle any part of the voters. It’s not going to help with the next stage apart from firing up a war of words instead of discussing the issues...

 

the last two polls conducted before the referendum had in favour of LEAVE,55%-45% and 48%-42%,so as the guardian at the time put it,'no wonder farage went to bed gloomy and woke up happy'

 

things is these polls are only 'facts' within those that were polled,

maybe its best to leave about ten years between the referendum then hopefully more young 'uns will be able to take part in it,

 

The Eu haven't even started negotiating yet. They've been waiting for an official position from the UK government. But yes, the big bad EU are making it terrible for poor poor Britain just trying to escape its evil tyranny.

Its took us 11 months to appoint the legal counsel to negotiate with the EU. The final candidate they arrived at was below their target audience and is considerably cheaper than what should be expected for the biggest negotiation in our history.

But let dogma and the Daily Hatreds headlines get in the way by all means.

 

Its since been put forward he had sight of the office exit poll data which showed leave was likely to win, and then gave his losers speech. Subsequently, hedge bets on currency netted millions of profit for him and his cronies. Which side of criminal that falls, that's for the authorities to continue to investigate.

 

There's been nothing stopping them doing that for the last 150 years. The argument that being part of the EU stops you trading with countries outside the EU ,both individually and collectively is a myth/ lie. In fact the EU has complex trading arrangements with other countries and continents ,which reduce the difficulty of import/export of goods and services. We are beneficiaries of these arrangements as members of the EU, when we leave next year we have to negotiate new arrangements. Also, why have UK companies and the Government not been pushing our skills and products in countries where we have Trading agreements? For example,India has 335 million people who do not have electricity, the UK is one of the leaders in generating electricity quickly and cheaply through Solar and Wind power. Why the heck have we not been pushing this ?
Politicians lie and don't have a vision, they are trapped within their own self interests and ideology.
Not having a go at you CambsTyke, just fed up with UK Politicians and their disingenuous statements/lies.