Brexit End Game.

I take the people as far left such as Tony Benn , Arthur Scargill, Bob Crowe, Etc . Granted two are dead but you get the meaning .

 

Is that your best shot at labour ? I could give better examples than that about what labour hasn’t done .
The Tories may have looked into fathers rights whilst making people homeless and robbing benefits off the disabled !!
I could go on but that’s balance enough imo

 

Let’s keep it factual; they have better immigration rights than your wife.
The UK treats all EU citizens almost equally (though it has flexibility to go much further).

None EU citizens have to jump through the same hoops dependant on their status in other countries in the EU.

 

Half a truth; whilst we might pay more in than we get out ‘directly’ the benefits of membership almost certainly outweigh the cost of that membership.
Since the Brexit vote; the economy has already lost more than our gross contribution to the EU. We are literally shutting up shop in a very lucrative market place in order to save ourselves the ‘rent’ paid to be there.

The cost of being in the EU is about 0.5% of GDP, if the cost of leaving is as little as ten times that, we’ll be getting off lightly.

Even staunch brexiteers claim several decades of recession, how is anyone still discussing what it ‘costs’ to belong? It’s almost like numbers are a mystery to them.

 

I wouldn't say I'm far left, but I dislike the EU for similar reasons. Whilst it's certainly a mixed bag overwhelmingly it's a capitalist, pro business organisation with some federalism mixed in. It's treatment of Greece was appauling, asset stripping its state institutions and flogging them off to France and Germany whilst its citizens suffered under their heavy austerity imposed boot. Dumb liberals never quite got this. That said there's some good things too, namely workers rights and environmental protection, but as I say, a real mixed bag.

 

I’m more pro EU for the workers rights etc and fuming at the successive govts not realigning more closely especially new labour , expected that from the Tories though.
Imo we are too far gone to start unravelling now .
This will send us into recession , most working class people travelling abroad will be hampered and food stuffs will rise as well as medicines etc . Of course the Brexiteers will blame it all on the EU and the war mongers and anti EU immigration wallowers will be kicking up a storm when they find that it won’t be stopped anyway and the Brexiteers such as Mogg are on the top ten rich list .
Even the most ardent brexiteers sfmit we will go into a recession but just argue on the length of it so ffs WHY.
40 years of collaboration cannot be undone overnight.

 

So how many Tory policies did Labour reverse last in power? Even the mining argument is flawed when Labour actually closed more pits than the Tories.
And I say this as someone who has never voted Tory. But under Corbyn I certainly won't be voting Labour again. Maybe once he and McDonnell, Abbott and Co are out of the picture.

 

It pains me to say this as someone who has come from a labour background and has always hated the tories but anyone who thinks Labour can win under Corbyn is deluded. The man is a joke and must be replaced asap for labour to have any chance in a general election

 

I’m not sure what New Labour reversed on the Tory policy list but I’m sure they did and they banned hunting with dogs .
There were plenty who wouldn’t vote Milliband who believed all the lies and propaganda they’d always some and they’ll be others who won’t vote for the next labour leader on the same footing so no surprises there .
As for the pit closures I know it’s been done to death but I’ll give it one more go but I think you already know and just keep repeating it hoping one day someone can’t answer .
Labour never put one miner out of work,
The labour pit closure programme was to man pr existing mines with the closure of old and dilapidated mines.
The coal from the mines that shut was gettable from nearby mines which would be made up of miners from these abandoned pits.
Now just remind me how many miners the Tories made redundant ?

 

Labours pit closure programme was propaganda made to look like what you described. It was all about cheap imports nothing else just like the Tories. So if Labour never put one miner out of work and pits closed, were the miners from those pits given new jobs? Nope.

As for Milliband, terrible leader, couldn't run a bath never mind a country. Had as much about him in PMQ's as a wet lettuce. Cameron absolutely rinsed him every week. Millibands strategy was basically just criticise anything the government propose yet have no credible alternative. Corbyn, wouldn't feel the country was safe on a defence footing with him in charge.. He is also promising too much under a false economy, the tax revenue he claims in his manifesto is not realistic, which essentially makes the entire manifesto unrealistic. Under a labour government I fear it will be the normal working person or small business owner that suffer. So under the current guise of Labour, they will defo not get my vote at any forthcoming election. Neither will the Tories for that matter nor the sneaky dems.

 

Closing pits was fine, leaving people and communities to rot without substantial help was unforgiveable. But hey, it was Thatcher and Co.

Don't confuse New Labour and Labour, two very different political parties policy wise.

 

Well you have real choice politically. Left, centre and right wing parties. You even have a Green alternative, or far right.

 

there's an inherent contradiction in your post. We have a Tory Government and despite being in the EU workers rights are under threat, the NHS is heading towards (part?) privatisation etc.
So the fact is that being in the EU isn't protecting the things that you (we) hold important - that's the present day reality.

Clearly being out of the EU means less outside influence on how our country is run.
But has being in the EU actually affected workers right TO DATE - has it curtailed any Tory policies?

 

I’ve just told you they were given jobs back into the industry ,
There was no propaganda at all the pits were undermanned people were leaving mining in droves .
I think your making things up to try and fit your posts and I think you should read up on the subject before quoting .
As for you wouldn’t feel the country was safe with Corbyn shows you to be your caught up in the propaganda .
Don’t complain when the Tories get in again .

 

They were all given jobs back in the industry.. No they weren't, many were laid off as a result. Little porky that Marlon.
I think your making things up to try and fit your posts and I think you should read up on the subject before quoting .
As for you feeling the country was safe with Corbyn shows you to be your caught up in the propaganda.
Love it how you feel anything not Corbyn is propaganda and everyone else is media brainwashed.

 

There were jobs for any miner wanting to stay in the industry fact .
Many would have had to move and many did hundreds came from Scotland Forrest of Dean and the Northeast etc to Batnsley ,Doncaster, Rotherham Mansfield etc etc .
Up to Thatcher many mines were under staffed indeed there used to be recruitment drives at school which a few on here will remember , or in your world am I making that up as well.
Yes your brainwashed about Corbyn because you’ve repeated the media lies about him so what other conclusion is there?
Didn’t need to read up about it I was there.?i think your reading the wrong books read the sun/mail by any chance?

 

marlon is right pal, under the labour pit closures of the 1960's there were no redundancies, men were either transferred within the industry or if they were old enough they were given early retirement, which during that period was 60 years old.

 

In the 60's and 70's the retirement age lowered from 65 to 64 to 63 and so on year by year thanks to having a very good trade union, and Marlon you are trying to knock a nail in a knot with some posters who obviously know nothing about the coal industry and are just trying to score petty political points, I know you are right as I was a miner in the coal industry from 1964 to its demise.

 

Brainwashed by the media pmsl.. I make my own mind up on Corbyn and sorry, do not trust him or believe he could implement his policies without running this country to the bottom.
I don't read newspapers and if I did it would defo not the sun or mail.. haha, talk about trying to stereotype people Marlon.

 

No apology for calling me a liar then ?
You havnt made your own mind up because you’ve quoted the media in your summing up of Corbyn!
And their not HIS policies they’re policies democratically voted in by the most Democratic of all the parties.
Your insistence on quoting media, stereotypes yourself without any help from me tbh.