No Deal Brexit

I don't assume to know why you voted remain but I respect your views and your reasons for them.
What has happened in this debate is that the 'Leavers' like me have been personally vilified - we are called idiots, cretins etc accused of not knowing what we are doing and worst of all (for me) being accused of being a Tory supporter.
But why do you assume to know why I voted Leave - it had absolutely nothing to do re getting 'attractive concessions.'
I voted Leave because I don't like the way the EU is going re. Nationalism - re influence of Putin in Hungary - the impending chaos in Italy - the undemocratic election of its officials - not sure what the impact of Germany heading for recession may be.

 

Anyone who says they are not more informed today about the whole Brexit issue than they were before, during or immediately after the Referendum are liars choose which way they voted. Yes, I know most of us don’t know/ and probably won’t know about the aftermath of Brexit for a long while yet, but I still stand by what I say

 

That is fair enough- I can only go by what your fellow leave voters that I know have told me. And I don't condone anyone being called cretins etc it is not necessary.

 

I saw this for the first time yesterday. I've never been a fan of Peter Oborne. In fact I'd say I was pretty much the opposite of being a fan. But there is some interesting footage and points that I must admit, at the time of the vote, I didn't even consider either.

Its about 9 minutes long but I found it quite sobering.

 

In general, I see Leave voters as a mixture of those that are informed and have a reasonable position, and those that are uninformed or have bigoted ideals. The informed might change their mind as they see how it is going, as could some of the uninformed. The bigots will never change their spots, but those I have contempt for are those in positions of authority or influence who have just told a steady stream of lies for years (decades in some cases) to get their own way. If leaving is going to be so good, then why were and are they telling lies to get their own way?

The simplification is the big problem though. We see so many people interviewed on TV, radio or comments on the internet that are "Just Leave Now", "Let's Go WTO" and the like who have no understanding of the ramifications of these simple slogans on their everyday life. I saw an interview with Dr Nicholl (who wrote the medical mitigation for YellowHammer and JRM insulted in Parliament last week). He has two big concerns - one is the stockpiling of body bags (why are we doing that?) and the other is the decisions that will need to be taken regarding the distribution of medicines. An example given was the use of the same medicine for epilepsy (potentially life-threatening) and some other neurological conditions - in case of shortages, it will go to the epileptics leaving the others in extreme pain.

I fear that a no deal will lead to people dying. I really fear this, and can't understand why 30-40% of the population are cheerleaders for something that has the potential to kill someone they are close to.

 

I do recall Gibraltar being mentioned, I think vaguely some screeching that the EU wanted to give it to Spain (because the evil EU empire have that power.... obviously!!!) but I really don't recall anything about Ireland at all.

I'd hope it was, but that I completely missed it, or that I've forgotten anything was mentioned, suggests it was fleeting indeed... probably a distraction from the Turkish invasion and the NHS BS bus.

 

One domestic bonus will be the end of VAT.

 

Well this is all going terribly well, Boris - you've got the EU proper frit!

https://www.theguardian.com/politic...an-stalls-disastrous-eu-brexit-backstop-talks

 

couple of points here Scoff, some of the biggest bigots i know voted remain and did so because they fear losing their jobs,so this notion that all bigots and racists voted leave is wrong,bigots come in all shapes, sizes and of different political persuasions.

Medical Shortages.. how do countries that are outside the eu go on for medicines?.. i'm not claiming to know here i'm simply asking, i holidayed in India for nearly 20 years and every time i went i filled my case with what i usually got at home on my prescription.. Pregabalin is the medicine used for epilepsy and also neurological conditions, i know because i was on 600mg a day of the stuff when i'd two prolapsed discs in my neck, i could walk into the chemist in Goa and order a 12 months supply of it for less than 30 quid,

Malaria tablets that cost 60 quid/euros for a months supply were available over the counter for less than thirty bob,Viagra was 60 rupees for four tabs, its about 50 quid for 12 at boots

what i'm trying to say is that medicines are available outside the eu so i honestly cant see why people should start dying and if the eu refuse to supply us in the event of a no deal brexit then uk politicians/leave voters wont be the only ones with blood on their hands

edit, i also saw the Dr Nicholl interview

 

It's hold ups at customs etc that will interfere with supplies and lead to possible shortages not a refusal to supply.

 

theres no reason why medicines from the eu cant be fast tracked through customs, maybe straight into some kind of bonded warehouse

 

That's what I hope would happen (our lass is on 5 different tablets for her MS but I don't know where they originate from) but nobody in power is actively putting peoples minds at rest by saying this will be the case thus leading people to be worried.......and they accuse remain of stoking project fear

 

Did anyone suggest that before the referendum was organised, a deal was struck between the UK and the EU?

That way a three way option on the ballot paper could have been instigated

a) The Deal
b) No Deal
c) Remain

The option with the least number of votes is eliminated

Then a final referendum between the two options left.

There......no ifs no buts no arguments

 

Sorry, Margaret Thatcher increased our VAT rates domestically in 1979 & they have been increased since by the Tories. Nowt to do with the EU. Before it was sales tax, which was 100% in the second world war.

 

I'd be glad to see the back of VAT. Pound for pound it hits the poor the hardest as they have to spend a greater percentage of their income thus getting taxed again where as the rich spend a smaller percentage and save more thus paying less pound for pound in taxes.

Scrap VAT and raise income tax 15% (as not everything is subject to it) across the board to make up the shortfall in taxes

It will never happen !

 

Absolutely. Then the Chancellor can start magicking money for the NHS etc out of thin air instead.

 

Any money saved if any by not sending our subscription will go on Tax cuts nothing more nothing less .

 

In the main they vote the way the whips tell them to vote....regardless of the views of either constituents or the MP themselves...goes for every party.

 

I’m feeling pretty crap about all this at the minute.

1) the government are stockpiling body bags and my mam will be one of the first people in one if they are needed. She could not survive more than a couple of days without insulin and once the 24hr mark passes there would be irreparable damage. I do not trust this government to care. When people flippantly say there may be deaths, it cuts me up inside each time.

2) a Latvian student at my school (who has severe autism - relevant as he struggles with uncertainty and change) asked me today if I could print out the dates he joined our school with proof as his mum is applying for settled status for his family. My coworker also told me her adult daughter who has profound learning difficulties’ application has been rejected over the summer holidays and she has been told to apply for citizenship instead. However, she cannot read and write and has zero chance of passing the test. To make it even more complicated, her younger son is British born so she may be faced with having to go back to Poland with her daughter and uprooting him from his place of birth to go with her.