Higham, Dodworth, Kingstone...

they really were caught between a rock and a hard place

Johnson knew his tory heartlands would never vote for Corbyn no matter what, irrespective of whether they voted leave or remain, Farage pulling his Brexit MP's just helped him with this.... in fact this was a massive part that has been slightly under played and under reported.

Labour voters it seems were willing to consider brexit as the most important fact, A dislike of Corbyn normalised their vote for Tory or Brexit ( as labour leavers were offered brexit, where tory were not)

dont get me wrong Corbyn himself was a big factor but the willingness of labour voters to consider brexit the be all and end all where tory voters did or could not was decisive.

 

People will say Corbyn put people off, but polls showed that despite not actually liking him he was still seen as being more trustworthy than Johnson. Strange, but true.

People didn't trust Johnson on many, many things but they did trust him to GET BREXIT Done!, especially as he was the only viable choice to do so. And because they wanted it done, they voted for him. Labour's polling showed people liked their policies. The Tories actually didn't really have any/many of real merit, but they didn't need any because it wasn't a domestic issue and they didn't want to dirty the political waters by engaging in it.

It's pretty sad stuff, but there we go.

 

agreed, Johnson hiding in fridges, refusing to be interviewed on BBC. it should be called out, the apologists just shrug and share a photo shopped meme like some great political comedian they think they are. fuckcing heartbroken at what this country has become.

 

It's because they don't care. They know Boris is a coward and a list but it doesn't bother them because they're selfish *******'s who want him to "get Brexit done". That's all they care about.

What pisses me off the most isn't the thick uneducated types who have been filled into thinking it's a good idea, it's the retired, wealthy local people who have had all of the good and now want to screw everyone else because it suits them personally.

 

If Labour want to get into power, they have to explore and listen to why there was such a big swing in some places.
Take somewhere like Sedgefield, it was on News this morning that Tony Blair held that seat with a majority of 20k.
I have no idea how close it was, but am presuming it was but to lose that sort of majority you have to take stock and listen.

 

Do you really believe that? Ok if you want then you can say that the reason there was no cash left was the Blair/brown government. We could have a sensible discussion on that. However what’s not for debate is that the coalition government made a political decision to deal with it by making cuts that affect (still the current tense) the least well off in our society.

 

Letters page in Chron should be interesting in about six months .

 

It just shows how terrified people must have been to comprehend Corbyn as their PM. Thousands and thousands of labour voters have defected to the tories, you cannot simply put that down to ignorance or brexit. One of these days people are going to have to come to terms with the fact that Corbyn has ruined Labour. He has swung it so far to the left that their core voters just felt disenfranchised. Corbyn is to blame for this, nobody else. Why can't we give Johnson a chance to govern now he has a majority? If it goes boobs up then you can give out all the "I told you so's" you want, but what if he makes a good job of it? will you credit him? or will you stick to the same grudge that you hold, and your father no doubt held and so on. By the way, the tories were rightly hated for what they did to us northern constituencies, but it was over 30 years ago. Lets move on and try and come together, otherwise we will fail.

 

Let’s not kid ourselves it’s who the press want in and nothing more .
They tore into Ed Milliband and the voters bought it .
It’s a case of either those that lap the press up and feed the billionaires (Tory’s) or those that appease them and give them what they want till the country grinds to a halt (Blair )

 

In 3 years it'll be an absolute mystery how they won these areas because everyone will swear blind they voted for Labour

 

They were terrified because they were hoodwinked by the right wing press into believing that Labour's manifesto was extreme, when it was nothing of the sort. Ok, some of the more radical policies were a bit unfeasible, but as part of a coalition in a hung parliament, none of the radical stuff would have got passed anyway.

 

But that will also bum my family and I, none of whom voted Tory, labour(except my mum) nor indeed did anyone positively vote for brexit in the referendum(remain or couldn’t make their minds up, still couldn’t)

 

What is stifling the party and the country is the MSM - They have always been against any form of progressive socialism. They and their friends want to preserve the status quo (no, not the band) the want to preserve their (inherited) wealth.

I find it obscene that so much money and power is held by so few people.

So the masses, well 45% of them anyway, have opted for Boris Johnson and his cohorts, winning 56% of the seats in the HoC

The coming months and years may well be a depressing place in England and Wales when Brexit unfurls, especially the north

One thing that will be certain is that the wealthy/powerful elite will stay that way. The rest of us well..........

Bashing Jeremy Corbyn is not going to solve the woes of the North, neither is electing a Tory Govt.

 

Not just the MSM - lots of stuff on social media that is outright lies, but to counter it you have to sink to that level. Do you become that which you hate?

 

Only very stupid people believe it.

 

A few points:

1. 'It was Brexit!!! Stupid'. As soon as Labour adopted their 'nuanced' position, they were doomed. The Brexit debate is far too toxic for Subtlety.
2. If Posters think Labour's manifesto was some kind of Radical, Communist, ultra left package, I can only assume you grew up in Chile. It was bog standard Western European Social Democracy. If people did think it was too left wing then we really have moved well to the right in the last 40 years.
3. It doesn't matter who the Labour Leader is, they are always going to be called 'Red' 'Subversive' etc.... Donald Trump could take the role and he'd be portrayed as a dangerous left wing radical by many. The tragedy is how easily some dupes fall for that nonsense. Corbyn was called a danger to future of national security while Johnson was part of the Govt that have given Britain's nuclear power stations to the Chinese!
4. Some people are going to suffer short term - most likely a lot who voted for the Tories/Brexit/UKIP parties. That's democracy. They will just have to suck it up. Longer term, there's better news. Younger generations are so much more enlightened, socially liberal and more aware of what's going on in the world than ever my generation and the ones that went before me ever were - and ever could be. They offer hope.
5. Additionally, we now need to sort out an ordered break up of the UK. God, it needs it. A more failed nation state it's hard to find. The Scots and the Irish will be fine - good luck to them. The Welsh? well they are really English, unless there's a Rugby match on. The key will be the North of England. Of course we're not going to go for Independence! but will we get off our knees and stop doffing our caps to Westminster/Whitehall? I'm not convinced, but if we don't 'take back control' people just need to shut up and accept that the future will continue to be based on a bias towards London/ South East that is cultural, economic, financial, political and nothing will change.

Hope.

Meanwhile, we've got a game tomorrow. Now that's a real cause for depression.

 

That's one of the most sobering things. We tried it the right way. Now we question whether it needs a Faustian Pact to get rid of the Tories. Play them at their own tactics of mud slinging and dirty tricks. Entertain neanderthal ideas about immigration and nationalism.

For the Greater Good might have to become the new For the Many.

 

On the flip side I suppose they are now represented by a MP who's party are in government.

 

Manifesto, policy, track record clearly are no longer election winners. Whats needed to give a good chance of winning is :-

1. A leader than can hold credibility and show strength not in general but at least better than the next guy
2. The ability to manipulate and position the news stories, media to suit your agenda
3. The ability to run and manage a smear campaign and discredit the competition.

People may be gullible and also the systems and technology may even be brainwashing even the more intelligent and less gullible person.

 

That may be the case but you cannot cast aside the radical elements of his manifesto on the basis that they probably woildn't be enacted. He put them in there, they were his ideas for this country and on that basis, he was soundly beaten.