O/T... Vegetarianism in the workplace...

Because I am yet to hear a vegan speak out against the activists, to go on tv and tell them to wind there necks in when they are being interviewed ( that's not saying nobody as but I am yet to see or hear it) like you say it couldn't happen overnight, if at all many a farm land is having concrete thrown on it for profit ( houses) the ones who are vegans or vegetarian crack on and good for them and many want us to go that way, not necessarily for the environment but because they thinking killing is wrong

 

You should fully buy into them.

Whilst methane output from livestock is a significant contributor to "greenhouse" atmospheric conditions, the much larger agricultural/food production issues: a) the amount of carbon that is required to produce 1 KG of meat comes out at about ≥10KG, as well as around 10,000 litres of fresh water — this is clearly unsustainable; b) the amount of forest that one has to destroy to produce the grain required to feed them.


Sources:
Hinrichs, C. C., & Welsh, R. (2003). The effects of the industrialization of US livestock agriculture on promoting sustainable production practices. Agriculture and Human Values, 20(2), 125-141.
Rautner, M., Leggett, M., Davis, F. (2013). The Little Book of Big Deforestation Drivers, Global Canopy Programme: Oxford.

 

If the entire country all went vegan at the same time there would be total carnage. Servers would go down in businesses, productivity would drop through the floor, telephone exchanges jammed.... it takes a long time to tell everyone you're vegan!

 

Last sentence?? Grain?? All the cattle I see, in this region (Italy/Germany/France at least, feed on grass in summer moving to uplands and hay/ silage in winter made largely from straw hay left after combine harvesters/bailers have collected the grain. Last time I looked I did not see people watering the grass (except Oakwell and other football, cricket fields and golf courses. I always take statements like the above gleaned from single reports with a pinch of salt.....

Humans outnumber cattle roughly 7 to 1 AND produce more digestive.... ahem ..gas... (figures quoted are that vegetarians produce around 60% more) than those on a mixed diet. The average person produces 0.6–1.8 liters of intestinal gas each day. The Environmental Protection Agency (EPA) estimates that methane production from livestock (essentially cow farts) makes up about 36 percent of the methane pollution that human activity generates.May 21, 2018
Whilst increased methane etc if everyone went Vegan or V egetarina would not offset the Animal produced methane it does not appear to be included in calculations nor does the report consider different feeding methods of livestock. Extrapolating data from one country production methods using grain and applying it to the World cattle population is highly suspect.

Correct me if I am wrong but were the authors writing in the context of heavy industrialised livestock rearing as practised in the US. Keeping cattle permanently in shed factory farming . Most of Europe feed cattle as I stated graze on grass and silage neither of which are edible to humans and non ruminants. Lamb is reared often on land unsuitable for arable farming. Much criticism and reports comes from academics and scientists often funded by organisation s with an agenda. As someone not too long ago on here stated. Science is brilliant but often the conclusions drawn from it are cr*p.
*****
Anyway, my OP was not about the pros and cons of vegetarianism but about the legality of disadvantaging a section of a workforce for being meat eaters. Someone has stated the odd meal when on a business meeting which is fine. Personally I have cut back on the amount of red meat consumption for health reasons as much as anything. However, if you are working 5 or 6 days a week away from home, reliant on hotels or retaurants or even working 4 weeks continuous (as happens on ITprojects for example) the subsistence allowance can run to £4-5k plus for food alone per annum and effectively that means either being forced to go vegetarian or take a substantial remuneration hit. affecting a proportion of the workforce being discriminated against. That is not freedom of choice but discrimination in the workplace

 

Interesting debate.on how life in general is changing from a diet prospective and its effect on the public at large ... It opens up many question numerous ethical and health points and dare I say human and animal rights issues.. In one sence from my perspective its a good thing but no doubt others will disagree and yet if I was the one being effected I'd see it as been penalised.... and dare I say singled out and having to conform to others beliefs.... Its like the old joke... how do you know who's vegan.... They tell you......
So guess what... Lol.... I'm vegan as many know... 10 years now... In fact may I also add vegan before it became fashionable too lol
I went vegan due to health reasons... Previously I was a mixed grill... prawn cocktail chocolate gateaux type of guy.. Bacon sarnies, apple sauce pork sarnies..pok pies bring it on.. .the lot.. You name it I'd eat it.....
But then I saw the light... Lol
At one time I'd argue the point about the benefits of being vegan when challenged why, to the point I'd get accused of ramming it down people's throats... Which has never been the case... Rather I answered every single question and explained with traceable fact why folk were wrong with the argument they presented to me why a vegan diet is or was wrong in so many ways.. they then would reacted by accusations when feeling they had lost.and backing themselves into a corner .... These days it saves lots of problems when I get challenged by those that have the righteous attitude by saying... I'm vegan because I can... Its my choice... Don't get me wrong if folk ask questions and are genuinely interested I will try my best to answer their questions openly from what I know and also based on my own experience... There's good veganism and bad... I know I've experienced both...lol These days in the shops there's more choice about, that its so so easy to say go on I will try that after years of making things from scratch.. Chopping and more chopping and even more chopping was and can be a pain especially now with the amount of stuff on offer in the supermarkets all full of hidden sugars salt, saturated vegetable fats and preservatives all tasty but not good and its so easy to fall into the trap... Due to the majority being very tasty and in some cases cheap... Not forgetting all the snacks now available too.
Years ago when you went out to eat you usually had a choice of salad and chips or chips and salad depending on what the chips were cooked in... Although things have changed you still have to be careful for cross contamination as many places still cook your bean burger etc on the meat grill which isn't acceptable from a vegan vegetarian point. There's definitely still a lack of training for staff in the food industry re veganism and I find that quite a lot of the older generation ( my age lol ) can be ignorant to the fact what veganism is.. That said some of the young uns can be equally oblivious to what it is all about... Ive had numerous episodes over the years, from been asked if I want eggs milk or chesse even Yorkshire puddings on my vegan meal even though I've made it clear when ordering ... In fact the most memorable happened in the subway store in barnsley bus station when ordering a sandwich... I asked for the specification sheet to see what the bread contained.. ( before they had the infomation on show on the wall )
This drew a blank look.. I'm vegan I explained I don't eat animal products .. I explained and asked with my Barnsley accent ( I speak as broad as most ) could you change your gloves please love... Ive Just changed them for the previous customer she replied.. Yes and they had meat.. Hes vegan my daughter replied... Oh she shrugged.. She continued to make my salad sandwich... Do you want egg.... no thanks... Do you want any sauce she asked... Please love.. but can I just see the specification sheet for your sauces just to check.. another shrug of the shoulders and a vacant look... My daughter by this time was getting more annoyed than me said... Look love my dad's vegan and doesn't eat any animal products hence all his questions... OK...
Another blank stare and I kid you not... The lass serving us snapped... Its not my fault but I'm sorry... I don't know what foreigners eat.. I'm not a dietician... True story
Today you can get food that looks and tastes like the meat and fish it replaces...also eggs too, believe it or not... Most vegans will tell you that you go through that stage of meat taste a likes when you first convert to changing you life.. Veganism isn't a diet its a differentway of life...
Both myself my wife and brother are vegan my parents and our kids and grand kids are not.. Whilst I hate cooking both meat and fish these days I will cook it but given the choice I avoid it at all costs dead flesh smells as bad as cigarette smoke to a non smoker.... Plus I need to rely on folk tasting dishes if they contain animal products... Most dishes can be made vegan by substituting with plant based products.. They taste and look like their counterparts... That said Yorkshire puddings don't rise as well but taste devine...
Its everybodies own choice what they eat.. and it's up to the individual to decide... I will steer clear of the animal rights issue as that on its own can in some cases be as emotive as the next
What I do advocate is to read the China study.. It can be found on line and its findings on dairy..as early as the 60s. make it interesting reading from a medical point of view... if nothing else... If you don't give up meat completely I'd advise loosing anything that contains dairy out of your diets...... watch the results... You will be amazed...
As for those effected by the meat ban by their company ..it might just be a blessing in disguise and the first step on starting a wonderful journey...
Catch you later guys got a lawn to....
...
Eat... not.... Lol

 

Vegetarian farts are 60% higher in methane?

 

Can you imagine the reaction if it was the other way round? Says it all really!
Personally it irritates the hell out of me how vegetarians and vegans try to foist their tastes on others, I don't keep banging on to them how nice a bacon sarnie or a burger is, it should be a personal choice.

 

Btw if they have a BLT can they claim two thirds back on their expenses

 

In a hundred years, people will find it incredible that we ever ate meat, just as I find it hard to believe homosexuality was a crime or that black people were forced into slavery.

It is clear to me that no animal should die in order that I can eat something. I can exist perfectly well on plants.

The death (see what I did there?) of meat-eating is around the corner, for environmental reasons and not for the love of animals per se. But it doesn't matter what brings it about, so long as it is brought about. Until we can treat animals properly, we don't have a prayer of ever being nice to each other.

So I am all for this, and for meat-taxes, and for whatever else. I bet your employer doesn't fund you 40 cigarettes a day, or a bottle of spirits. Why should they fund your desire (as opposed to 'need') for dead animal?

 

Well put across..

 

Lol

 

I try. I feel incredibly fvcking strongly about it.

 

I doubt that eating meat will ever be regarded on the same level as slavery. And my work does cover drinks as expenses.

Hopefully lab grown meat will be perfected and the issue will disappear.

 

My work also includes alcohol on expenses if out for a meal on work time.

 

Good post mate, just out of curiosity are you just vegan diet or a full on vegan, I.e not wearing of anything leather or animal products ?

 

Actually, 'surviving on plants only' flies in the face of nature. Recent research - albeit early indications with more data - needed reported only recently, show that brain development in infants is inhibited if certain minerals are 'missing' from their diet (something to do with neural path development -way over my head). These can only be found in animal proteins.

Whilst generally the developed World population eats too much meat and it is a relatively new phenomenon it is also true that on an evolutionary scale cereals and high protein intake is new and our bodies have yet to adapt (hence the views that allergies and things like glutine intolerance are on the increase)

The palio diet is how we evolved as hunter gatherers eating nuts roots fruit meat and fish i.e. omnivores (your teeth are evidence of that), and I also feel equally strongly that comparing eating meat to being a slaver is extreme virtue signalling and faintly arrogant.

To assume we, as humans, are anything other than animals at the top of the food chain (at least on dry land) due to our brain development and ability to make tools is false. Whilst I respect people who have chosen NOT to eat meat on ethical grounds, it is nevertheless a judgement call. I do not respect people who do so in the belief that they are morally superior. We are what we are and I, like many, have made my peace with that.

I have no problem eating meat but it is important that the quality of life of animals whilst they are alive is good and the manner of their death is also humane. I agree there are plenty of horror stories of mistreatment and unethical practices but that is not a reason to completely disregard meat in the diet.

 

You're far from alone on the matter, however I've long since given up arguing the toss with people.

 

Be thankful that we carnivores are eating cattle otherwise the whole world would smell of cow f@rt