Third Party claim is 100 Years Old....

Discussion in 'Bulletin Board' started by orsenkaht, Aug 21, 2020.

Page 1 of 5
  1. orsenkaht

    orsenkaht Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 7, 2009
    Messages:
    11,738
    Likes Received:
    11,434
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Style:
    Barnsley (full width)
    According to the Crynes, the Chronicle reports. It seems it's an old restrictive covenant which is now unenforceable and was to the benefit of the Senior family that owned the brewery. They also say the consortium was aware of it.
     
    orsenkaht, Aug 21, 2020
    #1
    Redhelen likes this.
  2. pon

    pontyender Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 18, 2005
    Messages:
    10,735
    Likes Received:
    3,828
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    Barnsley
    Home Page:
    Style:
    Barnsley (full width)
    If it's unenforceable, why has it become an issue?
     
    pontyender, Aug 21, 2020
    #2
    Stephen Dawson and Redhelen like this.
  3. orsenkaht

    orsenkaht Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 7, 2009
    Messages:
    11,738
    Likes Received:
    11,434
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Style:
    Barnsley (full width)
    A question better directed to the new owners.
     
    orsenkaht, Aug 21, 2020
    #3
    wakeyred, DannyWilsonLovechild, Stephen Dawson and 2 others like this.
  4. Mid

    MidlandsBFC Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 9, 2018
    Messages:
    357
    Likes Received:
    445
    Trophy Points:
    63
    Gender:
    Male
    Style:
    Barnsley (full width)
    Restrictive covenants don’t become unenforceable by way of age. Something like that should’ve been sorted in the due diligence process though- if the new owners were really worried they could take out insurance to cover the potential loss should anyone ever enforce the covenant.

    I would be really surprised if that was the only issue here, as that sort of thing is pretty routinely dealt with in the transfer process. I suppose the consortium could argue the matter was not properly disclosed, but that depends on the level of disclosure agreed between the parties. Information readily available on the Land Registry is usually deemed to be disclosed to the buying party.
     
    MidlandsBFC, Aug 21, 2020
    #4
    Kettlewell, Geddiswasguud, John Peachy and 3 others like this.
  5. Redhelen

    Redhelen Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 29, 2018
    Messages:
    37,105
    Likes Received:
    43,398
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Female
    Style:
    Barnsley (full width)
    That would make sense.
     
    Redhelen, Aug 21, 2020
    #5
  6. Ste

    Stephen Dawson Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 25, 2018
    Messages:
    34,252
    Likes Received:
    29,614
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    Style:
    Barnsley (full width)
    So is the old brewery land an ancient Indian burial ground?
     
    Stephen Dawson, Aug 21, 2020
    #6
    GudjonFan, wakeyred, Redhelen and 3 others like this.
  7. MDG

    MDG Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 21, 2005
    Messages:
    5,631
    Likes Received:
    4,170
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    Darton
    Home Page:
    Style:
    Barnsley (full width)
    Is it a covenant that prevents building anything on the land except sporting facilities for the community?

    Sure I heard summat like that back in the Sean Lewis days.

    So it can't be flogged off for housing etc..
     
    MDG, Aug 21, 2020
    #7
    Austiniho, redrum, Kettlewell and 3 others like this.
  8. Sopwith Camel

    Sopwith Camel Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 18, 2009
    Messages:
    12,366
    Likes Received:
    5,987
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Present
    Style:
    Barnsley (full width)
    Indian Pale Ale
     
    Sopwith Camel, Aug 21, 2020
    #8
    Connor, Redstone and Stephen Dawson like this.
  9. Tarntyke

    Tarntyke Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 29, 2005
    Messages:
    14,532
    Likes Received:
    12,667
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    Stairfoot, b4 famous rahnderbart
    Style:
    Barnsley (full width)
    I remember from reading from away back that the Covenant made it that the land could only be used for sporting activities only whilst ever their was a surviving member of the family (Senior family I presume) That’s why BFC were allowed to build the academy on the old Coop Sports ground. Also, there was only one family member left and he/she was elderly?????
     
    Tarntyke, Aug 21, 2020
    #9
    Stephen Dawson likes this.
  10. Ste

    Stephen Dawson Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 25, 2018
    Messages:
    34,252
    Likes Received:
    29,614
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    Style:
    Barnsley (full width)
    It can become a leisure complex, luxury sauna and casino though.
     
    Stephen Dawson, Aug 21, 2020
    #10
  11. Ste

    Stephen Dawson Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 25, 2018
    Messages:
    34,252
    Likes Received:
    29,614
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    Style:
    Barnsley (full width)
    Reverend Preedy's Covenant Casino:

     
    Stephen Dawson, Aug 21, 2020
    #11
  12. Gimson&theBarnsleys

    Gimson&theBarnsleys Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 9, 2005
    Messages:
    7,171
    Likes Received:
    5,825
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Style:
    Barnsley (full width)
    So the new owners are using a 100 year old covenant that they should have known about during due diligance to welch on an agreed repayment plan?
     
    Gimson&theBarnsleys, Aug 21, 2020
    #12
    Donks, Chef Tyke, Redstone and 4 others like this.
  13. pompey_red

    pompey_red Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 27, 2005
    Messages:
    13,465
    Likes Received:
    9,455
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Fareham
    Home Page:
    Style:
    Barnsley Dark
    Why all this didn’t come up when the takeover happened I guess is a debate point.

    would the covenant owner be using this to leverage a payment?
     
    pompey_red, Aug 21, 2020
    #13
  14. Tarntyke

    Tarntyke Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 29, 2005
    Messages:
    14,532
    Likes Received:
    12,667
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    Stairfoot, b4 famous rahnderbart
    Style:
    Barnsley (full width)
    I don’t know what the owners are using I’ve only read what’s been posted on here this morning
     
    Tarntyke, Aug 21, 2020
    #14
  15. man

    mansfield_red Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 18, 2011
    Messages:
    10,198
    Likes Received:
    16,768
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Style:
    Barnsley (full width)
    It's true that restrictive covenants don't become unenforceable by way of age, but if the covenant has become obsolete (say due to a change in the character of the land or the surrounding area in the time since it was made) then the burdened party can apply to the Upper Tribunal to have the covenant modified or discharged.

    An application for discharge will also succeed if it can be proved that the covenant impedes some reasonable use of the land and does not protect any practical benefit (or is contrary to public interest) and if money would be adequate compensation for the benefiting party.

    If the covenant is 100 years old I'd be surprised if it wasn't capable of modification/discharge. The interesting question would be who has the benefit of the covenant, and what approach are they taking that seems to be causing so much trouble?
     
    mansfield_red, Aug 21, 2020
    #15
    Kettlewell, BBBFC, 55&counting and 4 others like this.
  16. Ste

    Stephen Dawson Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 25, 2018
    Messages:
    34,252
    Likes Received:
    29,614
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    Style:
    Barnsley (full width)
    The Knight's Templar.
     
    Stephen Dawson, Aug 21, 2020
    #16
    SFOTyke and Tarntyke like this.
  17. Sup

    SuperTyke Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Oct 12, 2005
    Messages:
    54,454
    Likes Received:
    28,303
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Style:
    Barnsley (full width)
    If anyone has the John Dennis book I'm sure he discusses the covenant in there and how the club reached some kind of agreement with the senior family which could explain why it is unenforceable
     
    SuperTyke, Aug 21, 2020
    #17
    Gordon Owen likes this.
  18. tosh

    tosh Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Mar 20, 2008
    Messages:
    5,883
    Likes Received:
    2,804
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Occupation:
    Retired
    Location:
    North Sea
    Style:
    Barnsley Dark
    Or to the current owners of the ground.

    If this option to sell to the 3rd party is unenforceable then why? Too many scenarios going round my head to put here.
     
    tosh, Aug 21, 2020
    #18
  19. MDG

    MDG Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 21, 2005
    Messages:
    5,631
    Likes Received:
    4,170
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    Darton
    Home Page:
    Style:
    Barnsley (full width)
    Plus, a covenant doesn't normally impact on say planning decision. Someone normally has to make an objection that they are impacted by the breach..

    Quite a few commercial properties that were built on former Church land many moons ago, have some odd covenants like not selling beasts outside the premises or sale of intoxicating liqueurs. But again, it wouldn't stop a developer say opening a micropub, someone would have to raise a complaint that they are impacted by the breach etc..
     
    MDG, Aug 21, 2020
    #19
  20. Ste

    Stephen Dawson Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 25, 2018
    Messages:
    34,252
    Likes Received:
    29,614
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    Style:
    Barnsley (full width)
    They could call the micro pub the Voodoo Lounge.
     
    Stephen Dawson, Aug 21, 2020
    #20
Page 1 of 5

Share This Page