Workers that don’t have to go into an office are £480 billion better off.

‘This has improved my quality of life so f*ck the thousands who are losing their jobs because of the death of the city centre ecosystems’

Surely you can see how Tory you sound? No one on this thread is asking you or any of the lockdown crew to continue pointlessly commuting but a recognition of the individual cost to people’s loss of livelihoods and businesses rather than an ‘I’m alright Jack’ attitude is what people are after I think.

 

I can’t believe the amount of free market economists here who profess to hate Thatcher yet are all about letting the free market dictate ‘evolution’.

For the lady in the butty shop in city centre service industries in 2020 read coal miners in 1984.

‘Well I can get my coal cheaper imported from Poland so f*ck ‘em, the industry was dying anyway’.

 

You're aiming at the wrong target old pal. Because I was anti-lockdown. Right from the start. It's something I've mentioned a lot. Including in threads where you were getting it both barrels from the so-called 'lockdown crew', where I was backing your opinion (to a point).

I haven't posted anything like your first paragraph either. Nor have I intentionally presented an 'alright Jack' attitude. I've merely - like others - put over my own experiences through this challenging period that are relevant to the topic being discussed.

My missus worked in amongst the disease at its height, at hospital, 12 hour shifts. Bleak as fück. My city has had it pretty bad. I have pals who've been laid off from work. Mates who've been furloughed on 80% pay, yet to go back, who aren't sure what's happening. I genuinely think I'd have been laid off had the club gone down. Three family members dead with COVID on their death certificate. I know it's been a struggle, I'm very aware of the negative impact all this has had, and continues to.

I am not being a Tory because I've posted that not going into the office six days a week has been a breath of fresh air. I just see it as positive progress in my line of work, and a rare positive at that.

 

I think yourself and others are adding that view based on assumption. Like I say, I've merely given my own POV of the last few months, relative to the topic at hand. Just as you have, I believe. That's why I entered the thread by way of involvement. Because I felt I was well placed to share my own experience.

Nowhere within my posts have I suggested that businesses struggling doesn't bother me. If anything, I've become more likely to use such businesses that have been referred to as struggling, because I've been able to use more free time.

Considering you know me away from the keyboard, better than most on here, I find it quite amusing that you'd even think to put me in the sort of box you're suggesting.

 

Nobody has said it doesn't bother them. I've said from the start that the government needs to be helping these businesses to stay in business. The thing I've said is that I disagree with the government spending millions trying to reverse what's happened. It's not going to happen and it's a massive waste of scarce resources. Do you disagree with that?

For what it's worth, even though I haven't been into town at all, I've been spending a lot more than normal on local businesses recently. Covid has meant that more businesses have started doing delivery. I can now order local food to be delivered while I'm in a meeting and excuse myself for 2 seconds to answer the door. Previously I would have to wait a few hours and make some food. For weeks now we've been spending £10-20 a day on lunch for me and my wife, inc. delivery.

 

Obviously we have empathy for them but that doesn't mean that people should have to pay £300 a month, lose 40 hours a month, plus pay through the nose for coffee and sandwiches like some are suggesting. My point is only that no-one should be forced to go into the office like some are suggesting. I honestly want to know what those who are saying they should be forced to are suggesting.

 

It's literally the Tories' idea! Obviously we recognise that the consequence is **** but that's why we are in favour of support for people who need help when times are hard, not making laws to force people to have to spend thousands of pounds a year and hundreds of hours on travelling somewhere they don't need to be to buy something they don't need to buy. I'd support Universal Basic Income, I'd support raising Universal Credit, I'd support free education and support for retraining but I won't support stupid laws that benefit Tory landlords.

 

You replied to me buddy. I wasn't to know you were referring to others.

 

If only the country, just a couple of months before the Pandemic had the chance to vote in real change.

At the next election, it'll be more of the same from the Tories, and more of the same from Blai... sorry, Starmer.

 

it's not one or the other.
I'd rather all the money wasn't spent in multi nationals on city centre high streets and spread elsewhere.

I think it's ridiculous to believe that this money doesn't get spent elsewhere if we don't commute. that's simply not how economics work.

 

If central hub = town/city centre, then it's getting less and less strategic to position yourself in some of them. I thought that was the point of the thread. The businesses referred to need to follow the demand.

 

I think its really amazing how the government want people to rush back to the office to keep the supporting business open, *while still having guidelines that forbid it*. This is absolute peak 2020 Johnson government. Offices are down to below 50% capacity due to the social distancing guidelines, and public transport is around 25-30% for the same reasons. Until the government change their rules, it is not legal for everyone to return to the office.



As people have mentioned, the landlords and donors are getting twitchy about the loss of revenue. But also, since the Great Depression, the Tories have used the property market as an accurate way to predict the performance of the stock market - boom times see increases in property rates (and vice versa) quicker than other metrics which allows them to react with their investments in the stock market. If property usage is decoupled from the economy, they lose one of the key measures they use to invest...

 

I grew up in the 60s and 70s with Yorkshire Traction which was heavily subsidised. We never had a car, we didn't need one you just went on the bus. Maggie got rid of all that....

 

Surely it would be better to turn them into pleasant green spaces and subidise public transport? Thereby reduce the number of cars on the road making the whole area, including the town centre, a more pleasant environment.

 

Spot on JamDrop.

I worked for Jaguar for 23 years and had a 26 mile commute until my job was outsourced in 2013. I had a decent early retirement package but divorce forced me to buy my own house with a mortgage. Since then I've worked local to where I live and have commuted by bicycle - the health benefits of this have been huge both physically and mentally.

 

that’s the point being missed. What goes out of the pocket of pret will more than likely end up in the hands of more local firms and not remain tucked under the mattress.