No deal Brexit it is then

Do you actually believe this errant nonsense?

 

Good evening statis. First congrats on contributing to an overall debate rather than some of the more venal comments that usually inhabit such a debate on here. I think in response it is important to remember that governments of whatever hue come and go and although it is hard to dissociate the arguments from the people making them, that is what I resigned to do. In the referendum, I started out with a blank sheet of paper and tried to shut out the noise from both sides. The Eu's own website became a good source of info.
Here's why I decided to vote to leave:
1. The treaty of Lisbon created a separate entity of the EU. It is no longer a collection of states but a body that individual states pay fealty to. Plans were already afoot and now given body to in the Treaty of Aachen 2019 which lays down a framework for an EU army. Why do they need this and what use will it have in future years? (the EU do not have a good track record on international intervention)
2. State Aid (a sticking point now apparently). When the Chinese dumped loads of subsidised steel on the world market in 2015/16, killing viable jobs (including loads in the North) other governments (like US) retaliated or subsidised their own industries (like Belgium). Doing so broke EU state aid rules. The EU fined Belgium £250 million for breaching state aid rules and did nothing to combat the Chinese threat. Poland and other eastern European countries on massive state infrastructure programmes (funded by the Eu) liked the idea of cheap steel and blocked moves to do anything
3. State aid. Not a level playing field here. Eastern bloc countries get massive grants and exemptions from state aid rules to level up. This has an effect of moving jobs to such countries by big business. Eg JLR to Slovakia and Nestle to Poland taking advantage of this and cheaper wages/less workers rights, costing jobs in the UK. Hence the Uk Communist Party and Socialist Workers Party campaigned to leave and (I suspect Corbyn was ambivalent on the EU). This has no sign of letting up as there are aims for Albania/Macedonia etc to join. If you were a multi-national who could set up a factory anywhere in the EU and get a right to sell throughout the EU, where would you set up? Simples. cheapest labour = drive to the bottom of workers rights. These have been ripped up by Orban in Hungary and the Eu have done the square root of Jack.
4. Taxation. Again if you set up anywhere in EU you have full access. Luxembourg (under Juncker) and mysteriously tolerated by EU (oh hang on he became President of it) taxed profits on intellectual property at 6.5% rather than the EU norm of around 20%. Hence all big e-commerce set up an office in Luxemborg to pay tax there having exported profits that could have funded hospitals/schools etc in countries where they were generated (ever wondered why you buy things from Amazon/Ebay/Paypal SARL etc (Sarl is a Luxembourg registered company)
5. A sclerotic response to external and internal crises. The Greek debt crisis? Fudge after fudge and a wasted generation in Greece. Refugees at its border?? The only thing it did do was in 2011 bribing Turkey to take Syrian refugees with (amongst other things, a soft ECB loan to Ford to relocate its transit factory from Southampton to Turkey (goodbye 3,000 Uk jobs BTW)
So... we have an unclear political direction of travel, a complete lack of support when it comes to saving jobs but cosy tax deals and vanishing workers rights for big business and a failure to confront crises of any description. No brainer in the end for me, oh...I nearly forgot...
6. Tony Blair said we should stay and my gut reaction is to do the exact opposite of anything he says. (LoL)

 

I know people of your type care nothing for experts others amongst us acknowledge expertise and listen to it. You might like to try it for once in your life.

 

7. EU tax avoidance laws would expose many of our current toff classes, ever wonder why a no deal is preferable to the Tory party.

EU have faults but let's not vilify them when out current crop of charlatans are damaging the country. Taking back control means we're sick of foreigners doing what we've had not chance to.

 

You know f.uck all mate. Experts are only experts when they are right, very rarely happens.

 

He’s just reeled off 6 points why the EU are s.hite and that’s the best you can come up with?

 

Better tear up my books on Einstein. Are you able to do up your own coat?

 

I only write an essay if I'm paid old love, I've gone over this many times in great detail of the benefits.
Please explain to me in your words why you don't like the EU? Or is that beyond your intellectual ability other than they're foreign they are.
Gammon is what gammon does.

 

Post of the year tbh

 

Ok sweetheart,as I am not paid either I will refer to the honourable gentleman above. I can’t put it better than that. Sorry i don’t agree with you, but sometimes this happens in life.

 

It's a very accurate post, and no remainer ever said the EU was perfect but under our current government you'd be agreeing that you don't mind con men provide they're English con men.
In relation to subsidies and taxation these were voted on and we had a veto. We didn't veto so there was a reason for it. It's called creating an even playing field, some industries had to innovate and they didn't. China was and isn a massive issue but how to do control them? Tariffs only go so far, and I'm sure you don't benefit in anyway from cheap Chinese made goods?
It's more nuanced than the points made if you can get your head around that. Many nations United achieve more than one on it's own fighting against the system.

 

Wow!!.

 

Thanks for your input mate, really informative.

 

11 letter word you're improving, hanging around with us experts does have its benefits

 

Don't blame him gambling, our government have seen the EU and sold them as the enemy from day 1. David Davis turning with a biro for meetings without any proposals didn't help. Any normal government and I actually include Mrs May in this actually tried to negotiate. Boris put on his ten gallon hat agree to the same deal then walked back from it after selling it to the British people during an election campaign. It's in their flaming manifesto like many other things and they're not being held to account. Barnier is in a long line of folk who feel aggrieved.

 

Haha, nothing better to add so you start with insults. Nice, keep em coming!!!

 

Where have you been for the last 4 years?

 

When in Rome or should that be Margate or Skegness don't want to offend.

 

It’s as though you feel sorry for Barnier & the EU? I’m sure they wanted to be very nice to us in these negotiations too.

 

You know nothing about me or my Profession. I might not wear a security guard uniform but I’m doing ok for myself. Carry on old lad!!!!!