Might stir up a sh*tstorm with this one but here goes....

Nobody likes strikes. Simple. Whenever I see that trains are off timetable for instance or teachers are out I think its crap. HOWEVER what's usually not spun by the Government or media is that the workers themselves don't want to be on strike. They don't. They lose money and it can marginally affect pension contributions. Workers go on strike as a last resort, when they feel pushed into a corner and feel as though things are getting desperate. Strikes aren't a laugh for strikers. If unions decide, with their worker's votes, that they need to strike in the current circumstances they have my full support. I don't care if there's covid or a world war. If working people are getting dumped on and are struggling then the Government should be forced to sit up and take note.
It's no coincidence that since Thatcher the decline of union 'power' has seen income inequality increase. Cap for carers? ********!!

 

People went on strike during the Second World War - in fact days lost to strikes to were at a record high in 1944 - 3,700,000 days lost. Over 200k miners went on unofficial strike in 1944 when it was revealed their wage was £5 a week while the average non-skilled industrial wage was £6 a week, after the strike they went from an average of 81st in 1938 to 14th after the strike in terms of pay per week for employment. You can call them unpatriotic, but if you're getting stiffed doing life threatening and health damaging work then why shouldn't you demand more money? Same for nurses and teachers.
Ironically enough, probably the power to demand higher wages is only going to get stronger - thanks to Brexit, it might be a generalisation, but those most in favour of Brexit will be the same people complaining about nurses demanding more money, without any self awareness that cutting off the supply of labour surely strengthens the hand of those they are opposed to getting more money.

 

And nurses who are getting **** all

 

To be fair I don’t think that’s true mate, they said that NHS front line workers are excluded from the freeze.

 

Im just going on my wife being told shes getting **** all. She could always be lying and squirrelling money away so that she can leave us. Christ, is that whats happening, is my wife leaving me?
Im going to have it out with her, in fact im going to leave her first before she gets home.

 

Jesus man.
Capitalism in its extreme. Takes away from those at at all levels. Capitalism in its lowest form. can work alongside socialism. You want to know if I agree to industrial action. Only as a last resort. You are resigned to the fact everyone should cut their cloth. I’m just saying No to that. you have offered no other solution than more austerity for the working class. By saying no pay rises.
Oh If life was so simple. Don’t expect me to feel guilty that’s all. I would introduce the living wage as a bare minimum. Then some. Or should everyone live to just provide a roof over their heads. And feed themselves.
NO I don’t think anyone should be ashamed of asking for a pay rise that would probably allow themselves to live a life in comfort. Those on furlough or the dole through this pandemic should get more than enough to live on. Not make it the other way round. And make others suffer. Which is exactly what these proposals do.

I’m up for alternatives . Are you.

 

Well said mate, the current situation isn't a good one TU reps. It's always quite remarkable though how government departments see us as the enemy, we point out the bleeding obvious robustly and then they act surprised when their lawyers demand the case is settled out of court. A TU rep can protect all parties and ensure lessons are learned and individuals not fit to work for the department are removed. The ballot situation is a joke, they want a higher mandate than what MPs get voted in for.

 

His comment was Just about the barmiest reply in this thread mate. “ I HATE UNIONS, SCREWED UP MY LEAVE.” In a nutshell. Ay alreight.

 

Give me a shout when you do, cos mine says the same.

We can hire a camper van.

 

Also your Quote from your thread.
MY own view is that, people who have been fortunate not to be furloughed i.e. remained fully employed with normal salary (the vast majority of public sector workers) are represented by Unions demanding pay rises at a time when many self employed and Private sector workers have either been furloughed , laid off or worse still gone bankrupt.

Bit of a shift there mate. So it’s ok if public sector workers get a rise if MP’s do.
Not the fact you thought they should be ashamed of threatening industrial action due to how others have suffered and are suffering. Mek thi mind up.

 

Ill bring the tin opener for big bobs ******* beans

 

Hope you’ve made dinner for her first.

 

What everyone doesn't see is we're back at the start line for another 10 year race to the bottom. Taking back control will be the term phased when they start slashing H&S legislation and employment rights. They'll say it's the will of the people, that folk voted for it.

 

Why not make sure Amazon pay all their taxes first they've made millions in this country over the last 9 months. Why not make the big supermarkets who've been allowed to stay open and so generate excess profit while smaller shops have had to close pay a windfall tax.
But no the Tories will as usual seek to divide and conquer by setting public and private sector employees against each other by freezing public sector pay and using the private sector job loses as the excuse. But yet during the last 10 years when public sector jobs were slashed they never suggested the private sector pay more taxes to prevent them. The Tories need a bogey man to cover their incompetence so they'll pick a fight with the public sector unions like they did in the eighties with the NUM prepare for the enemy within headlines from the usual suspects Daily Mail Daily Express Telegraph and the Scum.
BTW I work in the private sector and was furloughed in the First lockdown and have been partially furloughed this one despite being considered a key worker because of the work I do.

 

Get ready for Mail headlines saying Bezos is a saint and junior / trainee nurses are lazy, greedy and need to learn their place. Patel will be health secretary by then and she'll be in operating theaters up and down the land telling world leading surgeons they're f*cking useless.

 

I love how often you tell us about living here. Whilst not living here.

 

Is the original post going for the most Tory post ever?

 

hows the single life treating you?!

NHS agreed a 3 year deal last year I believe, so while it’s true your lass isn’t getting new deal this year the old one is giving her a pay increase.

 

Not last year the year before. The current pay deal was set in April 18 and runs out this April. As of yet a new deal (if any) has not been put on the table.

 

Not a shift at all we were talking hypotheticals. If there is a pay freeze for the Public sector then MPs should follow suit. If it went the other way an MPs took their recommended pay rise then they should not impose a freeze on others.
Incidentally Johnson has recommended that the pay should be frozen although he does noit have direct control. interestingly he has frozen his pay rise AND that of ministers aince no 10 does have the power to do that. I am sure many on here though will find a way to turn that into some more anti-Govt ranting. He has stated that it would me morally reprehensible to take a pay rise in the current situation which was what my OP was asking.

Never said people should not be ashamed to ask for a pay rise. What I asked in the OP is was it right to threaten or carry out strike action in the current circumstances to get what they want. The fact that at the mere hint of a Pay freeze the first thing union bosses did was to get the big stick out with a threat of strike action before even attempting to start negotiating.

That said, there is a strong argument for a living wage where Benefits are not needed for working people. I have often argued that low wages, particularly in the private sector topped up with benefits merely makes more profits for companies by passing a proportion of the wage bill to the taxpayer effectively subsidising the companies and increasing shareholders dividends in the case of public listed companies. Increase wages and reduce the Welfare bill make companies pay. Initially they could cut Corporation tax and business rates to help the transition. Doubt that will happen though