Minority Report v Preston North End

I agree with much of that.

I saw the first 15 minutes and the last 35, so I can only comment on that period. But much like every other game I've seen under VI, there was a vast majority of hoofing it.

My definition of hoofing it is when you aren't necessarily aiming for a player, you know the ball isn't going to stick in the area you're hitting it or to hit into space knowing you haven't got anyone with at least a 50/50 chance of getting it.

Large parts of games we're hoofing it and making it messy on purpose. When you've people like James and Mowatt just heading it back or flicking it over their heads blind when they've the time and ability to bring it down and play, it makes it clear its an instruction and not poor choice or pressure from opponents.

Having said that, there are times we play some very fast one touch football in an area of the pitch we never would have played under Struber.

I'm glad we're winning, but frankly, I don't want to win at any cost. I always want us to do it cleanly with as little cheating as gamesmanship as possible (the three players lieing down as if they'd been shot in the last few minutes was sad and thought devalued us, yes I know other teams do it, but I want us to be better than that) and to do it trying to play football.

I prefer football direct and aggressive. Thats not hoofball though. Thats tricky or fast wingers, hitting a target man and building, but fast moving midfield play. Its to attack.

This team currently has the directness, but it feels 60-70% of the time the intent is to give the ball away as deep as we can manage in the opponents half to then try and win it back.

I hope the style is largely down to a transition period and instilling more nuanced ideas over time as he tweaks the squad and gets atttributes he needs to make the team his vision.

Its enjoyable to win. But you're right, at the moment it's really not enjoyable to watch.

 

Isn't it better to just enjoy the performance (admittedly, perhaps on this occasion for it's tenacity and effort) and the outcome, rather than trying to over-analyse it?

 

You talk as if he was trying to teach quantum mechanics to chimps. He was trying to get footballers who were too good for that division to win football matches. By playing Sam Winnall on the right wing.

 

I must be watching a different team.
We've outplayed Wednesday and Preston in the last 2 games, being superior in all areas of the pitch. Weve beaten 2 teams that we usually lose to and done it with some superbly worked goals. Playing the ball up to a striker or putting it down the channels for one of the wide men is hardly hoofing it to no one in particular. I cant remember a goal scored by hoofing it which suggests that all of our goals have been scored by playing good football. Id rather watch us play some half decent stuff and win than prat about with 70% possession and get nowhere.

 

Interesting post,not sure I agree on most,is your cup half full/half empty?VI is in my opinion making the most of what he’s got,he’s making us greater than the sum of our parts.

 

I too want to see us be more expansive without so much "vertical football". However, as a mate of mine said the other week...."he's building it based on getting results, the more expansive stuff can come later." I hope he's right.
Your mention of LJ brings up an interesting comparison in my head. I didn't want him to go either, because I could see what he was building. However when we were losing, it was awful. When your team loses football matches it hurts.
Under Val, we're winning. We're winning...not unfairly, not by cheating, but through guts, endeavour and hard work. It's not pretty at times but I don't think it's as unattractive as you suggest. At times we do mix it up...and there's the difference. Someone mentioned that's how Liverpool play and they're right. They mix it up. OK - we're not Liverpool but neither are we Barcelona.
I'd rather see us win than lose; even if it means we're not playing the type of football I would prefer us to play. On that point you and I clearly differ.
I much prefer to feel like I do today, after winning another game last night and seeing us 9th in the table, rather than trying to calculate how many points we need to get to avoid relegation.
At the minute, we're not a Bournemouth, nor are we a Wycombe.
We're a team finding and forging a new identity with, fortunately, the knack of winning matches to boot, under the leadership of a guy who clearly has a plan.

 

You've missed the point. It's not about your assessment of Lee Johnson. It's that you said you stuck by him and no one else did. Lots of people did. For my sins I went to meetings in my time reported back on here and took dogs abuse for backing him. Many people did the same in their supporting circles. So to then read that you were the only one who stood by him rankles considerably. I spent hours and hours, possibly days of my time standing by him and fighting his corner.

 

Post of the year!

 

Lee Johnson played the football you wanted to watch? It was possession for possessions sake. We played with no width, there was no one making runs off the ball & his side had zero organisation. It felt like every time we lost the ball we conceded. Just slow build up to the edge of the opposition’s box & then lose it.

It’s worth noting he got a lot of good players in their second seasons with us. He wasn’t having to rebuild a new side like many of our managers have in recent years who’ve struggled. He got Hourihane, Winnall, Watkins, Scowen etc in their second seasons with us & still couldn’t get a tune out of them for months.

Johnson only got that side going because of the signings of Hammill, Long & White. He was more or less forced into finally playing width due to how good Hammill & White were.

I’ve no doubt in my mind that if Johnson was in charge when Bree, White & Watkins got injured & Long went back to Burnley things would’ve fallen apart. Heckingbottom been a full back was a key reason Scowen was able to do a job at right back & George Williams did so well at left back in that run in.

 

I personally think we're just seeing the genesis of how Val wants to see the team play in the long run, but with a front three that are not what it needs. We're playing ok, and getting results, but just think how much better it could be if those long balls that are currently seeming "aimless" were actually going to a proper target man, who could win at least half the original headers, and has Woodrow and Chaplin/Vic/new signing running on to those that are flicked on into scoring positions, or the midfield running on to collect those second balls.

 

The footballs not great to watch but barring about 3 months under Keith Hill when we had Vaz Te, Butterfield & Drinkwater I’ve not seen us play winning football & also have the majority of possession at this level.

Even the Heckingbottom team that did so well for 5 months didn’t dominate the ball. We got success through counter attacking, brilliant set pieces & clever use of subs.

It’s hard for a club of our size to compete at the top end of this division playing nice football.

I’m trying to think of examples & you could argue Blackpool getting promoted when Charlie Adam was outstanding but most of the other teams of our size who’ve flirted with the play offs don’t play football easy on the eye. Millwall & Preston in recent years, Luton this season. None of them are good to watch. Swansea often gets thrown up as an example but they had a prime Jason Scotland & Jordi Gomez, two players we would’ve never been able to afford.

And I don’t think the football is anywhere near as bad as the opening post suggests. There’s been lots of nice football played involving the wing backs & central midfielders but we play it in the right areas & when we go forward at one side one of the two central midfielders tends to sit as does the wing back on the opposite side meaning it’s hard for the opposite to outnumber us if / when they counter attack.

The one time this didn’t happen was against Bournemouth where we probably played the best football we’ve played all season first half but it came at the cost of us been wide open defensively & looking like we’d concede every time they got the ball off us.

 

It's pretty ironic that for a man famed for calling for patience, you already appear to have grown tired of winning.

 

It now seems we can mix it up when needed.

Doing the ugly stuff and not faffing about. Row Z and clearing our lines etc.

Then the one touch stuff and fast attacking and pressing .

 

I will have to be more careful with my hyperbole.

 

Just to add to my earlier post regarding seeing the first throws of the system Val is trying to play(but with players that are far from ideal!). I was just thinking about the two outstanding teams of the last few years that won the Premel League by huge amounts, Liverpool and Man City. Both teams went through this process of trying to implement their tactical philosophies early in their tenure, but like us, lacked some players that would become key to them pulling it off. Guardiola was very hip and miss until he was able to bring in a 'keeper who could use his feet amongst others, and Klopp looked very ordinary until he managed to bring the likes of Alison and Van Dyke in, after which they looked unbeatable! Even Spurs under Jose Mourinho have started to look like genuine challengers after looking shocking last season, once he was allowed to get "his" type of player in.

I think we should all be looking at things as a work in process and avoid any hyperbole(be it negative or positive).

 

One of the key things that seems to escape RRs analysis is the effect of man management on individual and team performance.

You can talk all day about tactics and playing style but man management is a huge determining factor in the success of any team in any walk of life.

It seems minority report doesn’t understand, or consider enough, the human element of winning football matches.