Leak from the Times

Fully agree with this.

 

Isn't it based on real world testing for anti bodies or whatever the vaccine gives a longer period after the initial dose?

 

There are definitely lockdown fanatics. We've got one poster in here calling for permanent social distancing. We had many calling for hard lockdowns in spring of last year, and saying they shouldn't have been ended, and saying they should have restarted etc.

My comments weren't about January and February they were about the 9 months of lockdown fanaticism that came before that.

Are you actually saying none of them want restrictions to continue (which is what is happening and being proposed) because there really are quite a few calling for longer lockdown and longer restrictions. Maybe you aren't but there are some on here and many out there who are.

And yes there are some loving sitting at home. Don't you remember posters on here telling us how it had been a fantastic year for them having their kids at home while they were at home too, living a glorious life of family bonding which has been really enjoyable and something they will miss when it ends.

 

Sorry mate but I think you are the fanatic here. Why would you believe that a political party (in government) which has always stood out against state control, is controlled by big business which needs the world to be completely open and back to normal, would want to impose unnecessary restrictions on individual freedoms? I hate the Tories with a passion, but their methods of controlling the masses are diametrically opposite to what we've seen over the last year and have always been based on keeping the masses poor.

 

One poster mentioned it then - fair enough.

I also didn't realise that you weren't on about the last few months - I thought that was the topic of conversation.

I must think of the counter term to Lockdown Fanatics though for future reference. Perhaps those should be called Death Addicts? Or Funeral Followers? Just so I know.

 

As I said, I don't know.

Is "real world testing" another way to say "let's just see how it goes"?

 

This, plus as much as I despise the PM, he is well known to be a believer of libertarianism. I don't see any reason why he would want to lockdown the nation it's just not in his nature.

 

Danger Deniers.

 

Well yes I think it was a case of let's just see how it goes but real world testing doesn't mean that. It means continued testing in the real world (as opposed to under clinical trial conditions) and it appears that they got lucky that they got lucky with the results of those tests so far

 

Touche.

In that case, we can change the Lockdown Fanatics to Life Savers or Old Folk Champions?

 

I like 'Branch Covidians' for the lockdowners

 

But then that jars with those places who have lockdown down fanatically (there's that word again) and performed way better.

I'd love to continue this cyclical discussion, but I can't see it going anywhere.

Lets just agree that I'm not a Lockdown Fanatic and you don't want to slaughter anyone over the age of 45.

 

Of course, hopefully the new variants will still be covered by the vaccine which so far seems to be the case according to the experts.

 

We have loads of TAs who are 60+ (pretty much all of them actually), staff who are type 1 diabetics, have MS, have severe asthma etc. none of which have been offered a vaccine yet but schools are going to be fully opened on 8th March if rumours are to be believed. 1600 kids all back in the same building again with zero change for everyone there than there was before Christmas. It will be 10 days in some schools (up to 15 in others) before Easter, is it worth opening to all for those 2 weeks? It could have been used to stagger start for exam years as mentioned previously with everyone back after Easter giving more time for vaccines to be given and the couple of weeks it needs to take effect.

On a personal note, my mam who has a whole host of health problems still hasn't been offered her first vaccine yet just a phone call saying look out for a letter. She turned 60 on Saturday so hopefully that will increase her priority even though her health issues put her up there anyway. My 63-year-old dad who has been working in a busy meat factory throughout hasn't been offered the vaccine yet because he's not old enough. I know that means he's also probably not as much at risk but I'm still worried about things opening back up whilst neither of them has any extra protection at all and so few of the most vulnerable have had their second vaccine. I know people are worried about jobs, I know people are worried about mental health and loneliness. I'm not downplaying either of those things. I'm worried about my parent's lives and please don't downplay that either. I'm scared that after a year of all this they are going to get ill and maybe die so close to the end. Everyone's worries are important to them and the sooner this all is resolved for everyone the better.

 

People want longer restrictions/more gradual releasing of restrictions because the number of cases is still too high and the number of people dying is still too high. Not to mention the relatively high number of people, including children with long covid.

According to this, 2 doses of Pfizer are 98.9% effective - https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/...stopping-severe-illness-study-finds-pczcx5m2d
Although I've just had a news alert showing that the Pfizer and Oxford jabs are 85% and 94% effective at reducing hospitalization.

Currently, the government is "promising" to vaccinate everyone by the end of July (I think that's one dose, but ignoring that for now). If the vaccine is so successful, and can reduce hospitalization/death by 90+%, then if we open up earlier for every 100 unvaccinated people that are admitted to hospital between mid-March and end-July, over 90 of those were unnecessary. The same for deaths. For the sake of 100 days, when we could open up fully because everyone is vaccinated - although we would probably need border controls/quarantine to prevent new strains entering the country.

Now, you could argue that if 100 people die of/with Covid in that timeframe it is worth it, but at the moment the 7-day average is 488 (3416/week). This is falling, but at the current rate it will fall to around 200/day by 8th March. Another 2 weeks (22nd March), would see the deaths around 100/day (hopefully lower) and returning to school after Easter would see it around 25/day - and have a lot more vaccinated too.

The other issue is the rush into things. Why open school to all years on the same day? - Why not open to year 13, 11, 9?, 6 and 2 (Key Stage and exam years) initially and see what happens to infections? Then open up to years 12, 10, 5 and 1 after 2 weeks and everyone else after Easter. Why open sports clubs on the same day as schools? Each of these events will have an impact on infections and it is not possible to judge the impact of one thing when you are doing several at the same time.

Nobody likes lockdowns, but they are a tool to delay infection (and death) in the population. It has delayed it to the stage where we have several working vaccinations - and a plan to have everyone vaccinated in a matter of months - although we have an absolutely devastating massive death toll from this disease - Covid is now the 12th worst epidemic in the history of mankind (and isn't finished yet). And the risk is, if we get this wrong (and the gov haven't a good track record over the last year), we end up back in lockdown *again* or with more unnecessary deaths.

 

Firstly I think that all teachers and pupils should have been called in to have a vaccination as soon as the over 70s and highly vulnerable were completed. 66 year olds are at a much lower risk than 70+ so short delay to that would not have been the biggest problem.
We all know just how good schools are at vaccinating, and with 24,000 (roughly) schools in England they could have vaccinated every school child and every school employee in less than a week. That would have been one week ago and they could then be waiting for just two more weeks like you said before going back to school knowing that the risk of it spreading throughout schools would be much much lower.

Secondly I hope your parents, and anyone else who wants one, gets a vaccine soon. Personally I think that the policy of giving 'spare' vaccines to completely random people at the end of every day has been absolutely crazy. They should have moved straight onto the next vulnerable list and called them up. It would have required planning in order to do it and I don't blame the doctors for not having those plans or staffing levels in place but as a government Boris and his clown mates should have had those plans in place. But that's just a minor point I guess.

Hopefully your parents get theirs soon, especially your mum.

 

These threads are purely a means for many to vent their frustrations by taking it out on strangers on here.