She was sticking to the rules, Dawn Butler said (correctly) that Johnson told lies in Parliament, no MP is allowed to accuse any other MP of lying to the House. It's not a matter of opinion.
Just to note, the deputy speaker, was the deputy deputy speaker as the deputy speaker is isolating. I believe that was her first sitting in the speakers chair. She was merely adhering to what the rules are, which is that there is no suggestion anyone in the commons is lying. A perfect environment to be usurped by liars. Its bizarre and completely outdated, but it seems the commons wish to keep much of its outdated practices that aren't fit for a democracy in the 21st century.
The punishment for (correctly) accusing the PM of lying in Parliament is the same as 3 Tory MPs got for trying to influence a judge in the criminal trial of a former Tory MP (Charlie Ekphicke) - an act that would have seen us facing prosecution for attempting to pervert the course of justice. The punishment for the PM, Home Secretary, and other Ministers for lying to Parliament is nothing.
You don’t think she looked like a rabbit in the headlights, all stuttery and flustered and needing bits of paper passed to her because she doesn’t know the accepted form of words?
No they are not. Some are, many are not. Can you name one occasion when Keir Starmer, Joe Cox or Caroline Lucas lied to Parliament? The majority of MPs tell what they believe to be the truth and if subsequently found to have misled, then they correct the record. Routine lying in the House of Commons only began when Boris Johnson became Prime Minister.
Its only 17 years since Johnson was sacked as Shadow Minister by Michael Howard after lying to his face about an affair - an event that should have seen him disbarred from holding a senior position in the Tory party ever again.
At least he's learned from it.... I mean it's not like he's had any recent affairs and lied about them..... oh.... hang on
Don't know why anyone is surprised, the whole set of em tend to lie as soon as their mouths open. But all the speaker was doing is following the rules, she did nothing wrong. Until the MP's vote to change the rules, nothing will change.. So nothing will change because they all want to hide behind the rules when not telling the truth.
This is a very dangerous narrative that the current puppets and their masters want to push - the they are all as bad as each other idea it is demonstrably untrue. As mentioned elsewhere there are many MP's who would never blatantly lie in the way that Johnson and his goons do including some Tories and some former tories kicked out becuse they wouldnt do exactly as Johnson/Cummings told them
Skinner was borrowing heavily from Disraeli when he made that quip. Look to Erskine May, the bible of parliamentary rules and conventions, for the origins of the rule which is premised upon a desire to punish ‘unparliamentary language’. Hence phrases such as ‘economical with the truth’ and Churchill’s exquisite ‘terminological inexactitude’ which convey the same message without offending the parliamentary ear. Tolerance of loose language and politicians calling each other liars day in day out is not an attractive scenario in my view and demeans our democratic heritage. It’s a short step from there to the kind of mayhem sometimes seen elsewhere with physical violence between politicians often the ultimate outcome. The Deputy Speaker did nothing wrong and was assisted only in the precise form of words to be used in the face of Butler’s refusal to retract her allegation which she made fully aware of the inevitable consequences and, no doubt, the publicity it would bring her. A cheap shot, as it would be fired from whichever side of the House.
But whilst the government openly lie and don’t follow the rules to retract or correct, this will happen more often. It’s not Dawn Butler demeaning Parliament it’s the First Lord of the Treasury openly lying and not following the rules. Frankly this post has reduced your standing here by several steps. It reflects poorly.
My observations are made from a neutral assessment of the matter at hand and would apply equally to any MP from whichever party. You speak from an obvious position of impartial party preference. Disappointing to have ‘my standing’ on here docked having sought to contribute to the wider issue but I am reminded of the wise words of Imam Ali AS: The moment you begin to argue with a fool, you have already lost.
I agree, they're not ALL liars as a large number do nothing at all. Granted there must be a few decent ones, there must be
It’s what the media want you to believe- they’re all liars, there’s nothing between them - it is, in my opinion, a question of degree - no one (politician or not) tells the truth 100% of the time - however, the Conservative party, in particular cabinet ministers, has taken it to the extreme. A courteous person shouldn’t call anyone a liar in the HoC apparently but neither should a person there lie! The Speaker should compel the PM to correct any untruths (ie lies) but he/she doesn’t even tell him to answer the questions that he is asked! It’s weak & the liars take full advantage! Johnson should be compelled to return to the House & put the record straight! He demeans his party, the HoC & ultimately US!
Say what you like about Thatcher, and I hated her with a passion, at least she didn't blatantly lie to the House. The majority of MPs are honest, straight, hard working people with a mission to improve the country. Unfortunately, most such people were purged from the Conservatives by Boris Johnson and replaced by the corrupt shower we have today.
