20 years, for what?

This means far more than any of our empty words and I find it very disturbing to listen to.

https://www.channel4.com/news/afgha...ing-we-worked-for-says-kandahar-ngo-executive

 

The decision to withdraw US troops was made by Trump. It was a decision Biden could have overturned and, had he done so it would have opened him up to attacks from the Republicans.

 

If you’ve got the BBC Sounds app, search ‘good morning scotland’, click on today’s show and go to about 2hrs 40mins in. The interview on there is both fascinating and harrowing. If I knew how to link from the app I would.

 

It seems to me to be a screw up by the world in general. Biden included.

Although if the Taliban just wish to rule their own country persons, then fair enough. Let them get on with it. Force at the end of the day is what China and Russia etc. use

Afghanistan has had plenty of support to try and stand up to the Taliban. They show that they have too many other loyalties to do it properly. They're not bothered about democracy so much. Or our values. Can't blame them.

We can do no more.

 

Taliban are made up mainly of Pakistani insurgents from the border regions , not many from Afghanistan from what I hear and also foreign fighters flocking there to impose strict rules on the locals .
Afghanistan for Afghans is not the Taliban Mantra .
Won’t be long before there’s beheadings etc if Foreign Journalists/aid workers etc.
The fighting had been almost done by the allied forces bodies of our soldiers coming back was almost non existent as the Afghans took up the fighting with US/Uk support .
Trump all about a told the Taliban leaders to move in just as he did in Syria with the Turks .
We sold the Afghans a dream , kids going to school etc and were just leaving them to face punishment because they took us at our word .

 

It's their country, not ours.

There will be blood.

We did our best to help them.

They've chosen not to fight the Taliban with sufficient gusto.

We were there to protect our own interests. This worked. But I bet it won't last.

We provided them with protection and the chance to build their own country, more in line with our own understanding of modern day freedom.

For 20 years.

This area is beyond our normal comprehension.

 

I think its terrible that the Taliban look set to take over. The consequences for many Afghans, especially women, will be dire. That's my western liberal logic however. Very often its not our place to go into areas of the world, especially with troops in order to mould a state or people as we see fit. We in the west often show a complete lack of empathy and understanding for native populations and their wishes and needs. We also forget history, forget cultural values and forget that sometimes we are not actually welcome. Power politics on the international stage is pants.

 

Seems most of the Troops that’s actually been there that’s been interviewed etc and actually interacted with the locals disagree with you .
Obviously neither of our views will be anywhere near the actual situation .

 

It's obvious also that the locals will say whatever sounds best to which side of the argument they're being asked from.

The answer given, to the same question, to the Taliban will be different from that given to a squaddie.

Can't blame em for that. I'd do the same.

Reminds me of a carry on film, or summat like, in the middle of the desert, where they kept changing the flag they were flying, acording to which lot were next to occupy.

 

or maybe the squaddies actually saw and interacted with people who were living their lives with more freedom than they had for years and saw the benefits first hand, especially the women!

 

Well I'm all for spreading the word as far as freedom is concerned. And I think we all know what freedom means on here, even if we don't always appreciate it.

But there are areas, towns, cities in Afghanistan which are not hostile to the Taliban. Whether we like it or not.

Their culture. It's beaten us. Not because they want all that will now come their way. But because they don't care enough about what the alternative for them is, as presented from abroad.

In general of course. Doesn't stop them being the most hospitablre of people, given the chance.

 

50% of British Muslims think homosexuality should be illegal. If those people can't be enlightened despite living in a western democracy there is no way we would ever convince enough Afghans to turn away from the Taliban. Part of me thinks there is a hope that the Taliban start attacking Chinese citizens because of the Uighur situation, and then the Chinese roll in.

 

MMMM,,, the Taliban and the chinese are in discussions. Don't think the Taliban are actually principled Muslims. They earn most of their money by selling heroin which is haram (forbidden) in Islam. Make no mistake. We had about 5000 NATO troops in Afghanistan who were not involved in combat operations and were no longer taking casualties. The US withdrew because of politicking by first a buffoon president and then a doddery old man with no grasp of reality. I think it was G K Chesterton (might be wrong) in the thirties who said:
"America in the World is like a big friendly dog in a small room: Every time it wags its tail, it knocks a chair over".

 

We are a tiny island in comparison to some of the countries in the world.

Personally, and I may not understand the ramifications of what I'm about to say... but,

Keep our nose out of other countries affairs. Let someone else do it. Or let them make a decision whether to interfere or not.

I'm convinced our constant meddling in other countries and joining the US on every party causes more issues at home.

We are the closest ally of the US to these countries, so it makes sense (to me) that they attack us rather than them.

I'm convinced the US laugh at us taking the **** they want to cause.

Happy to be corrected, but thats how I see it anyways.

 

In terms of landmass, we are yes. However, we are a top-ranked nuclear power. A permanent member of the UN security council, a G7 member, the 5th/6th most powerful economy in the World and (according to RUSI and Janes Defence Weekly-they both count) the 4th or 5th most powerful military force in the world. With all that in mind, what do you tell a 13-year-old Afghan girl who last year had dared to dream of a future but has now been dragged out of school and married off to a Taliban fighter she's never met.
I agree we've been half-assed in dealing with the Taliban. But the number of troops which were largely symbolic to keep them in their box in recent years seemed a solution of sorts (personally I would have eradicated them completely when we had the chance) but we've given these people a taste, particularly the women and then just abandoned them. And yes I think their menfolk are total cowards, the Afghan army outnumber the Taliban 3 to 1 with better weapons but they won't fight.

 

It's a fair point pal, I don't disagree.

I'm just in the mindset, that no matter what we do, our culture's are so far apart it will never be sorted...

Dunno, hence me saying happy to be corrected.

 

It's easy for people to say it's not our place to get involved. I would like to think of our country was in a crisis like that other countries would come here to try and help us.

 

Ar, but not treating women as equals is barbaric whatever tradition says.

 

I agree completely but that's just what me and you think. Other people think different.

 

It is a relatively modern way of thinking.