Surely this is the end

The death penalty doesn't work as a deterrent, is more expensive than life imprisonment and is ******* barbaric. There's no credible argument in favour of it and so I'd definitely say it's a horrible view to hold.

 

Their crimes might be barbaric but that's no reason for executing them. When there are no other arguments in favour then it's just revenge killing perpetrated by the state. I don't know how anyone can think that society inflicting "an eye for an eye" type justice (and inevitably executing some innocent people in the process) isn't horrible.

 

That’s your opinion. Fair enough. But you’ll respect some don’t agree with that. And it doesn’t make them horrible people if they don’t agree with you.

 

I never said they were horrible people, just that it's a horrible view.

 

If I committed an horrendous crime and the judge turned round and said 'terribly sorry but you murdered that young person for no apparent reason, so we will have to put you to sleep', I would probably think yes that's probably fair enough.

 

I'd be interested to hear what that credible view might be.

 

Plus you have to think of the effect on the executioners. A lot suffered mentally, some even commiting suicide.

 

As much as you’re entitled to your opinion, other people are also entitled to theirs.

It’s a remarkable modern phenomenon that people who stamp their feet for the right to hold an opinion can’t grasp that their opinions will lead to other people building a negative opinion of them.

In my lifetime I’ve seen dozens of people released on appeal that were accused of crimes that you’d have happily murdered them for.

So it is absolutely barbaric (and utterly dumb) to support the death penalty; In my opinion (which I’m perfectly entitled to).

 

And what if you weren’t guilty but the jury had been convinced that you were.

You’d still think ‘fair enough’, as due process had been served?

 

Revenge then. Are the innocents who get executed acceptable collateral damage so long as the state gets to kill some actual wrong 'uns? Actually why stop at the death penalty, let's torture them for a few weeks first.

I see this as a black and white issue, I can see literally zero merit or argument in favour of it. I don't think it's unreasonable for me to say that. The only argument put forward in its favour is basically revenge and society should hold itself to a higher standard than that.

 

And that’s where we differ…..

I don’t build an opinion of someone over 1 or 2 views they hold online. I base it on the whole person whom I know in person, and everything is in context.

I don’t agree with you on this subject, but may agree on others with you. I don’t know you, and therefore have no opinion of you.

 

But the fact remains you are still having to kill another person in cold blood. Also, Ian Brady wanted to die, Myra Hindley was desperate to be released, even though her life was obviously going to be endangered.

 

I'm not ignoring anything, you're just being supercilious in trying to claim the moral high ground by implying that my view is somehow unreasonable for being strongly on one side of the matter. That's deja vu for me.

On the substance, what does "obviously guilty" mean in this context? Anyone found guilty is supposedly guilty beyond reasonable doubt.

 

But what if the judge said that but you hadn’t murdered that young person for no apparent reason?

 

A society that aspires to develop and transcend barbarity can not achieve that by resorting to the very same barbarity perpetrated by those who transgress.
It's a no brainer for me. The death penalty does not work as a deterrent and it degrades and undermines any society's claim to be enlightened.