Morning after the night before

Emotion has subsided, we can all be a bit more objective.

I still think he’s got to go. He’s just not got an idea.

 

Needs to be binned off. Might give the players a lift so close to the weekend. The players look clueless with what is expected of them. No more than Woodrow who is playing right wing and trying to cross balls into himself as nobody else is there.

 

Says alot when Britain went over to schopp straight after they scored having a discussion. Would love to know what was been said there.

 

Probably saying "we're both out of our depth here boss"

 

Its the total lack of any idea the team has. We dont look like ever scoring from open play. Players have no idea what there doing. He cant see that things arent working and stick to same system all the time. Players playing out of position when we have players capable to play in natural positions.

Iseka n Cole must be better options than Odour up top and Gomes better than Brittain in the middle.

Vita signed on loan. Is he just not good enough to play in front of williams? If not what was the point.

Centre Mid and LWB are changed every game. No one knows whats going off

 

He wasn’t last season

 

He wasn’t out of his depth as he had a strong leader with a distinct setup, who wasn’t afraid to tell his players what was required and who the players all played for.

None of that applies now. He has no idea but he also doesn’t lead, at least not in the way these young lads need to be led.

 

Think Brittain is one of the best right sided defenders in this league on his day. Can’t shoot for **** but is a right player. Schopp is ruining the kid as he is with a number of others, including Woodrow.

 

The manager continually plays players out of position , it is square pegs in round holes & it does not work , there are 36 matches to sort it out but I think Mr Schopp may soon be on borrowed time .

 

It was a bad night, there's no escaping that. I've conflicting emotions after seeing that.

There are compounding factors as to where we are now. And they can't be ignored. Our core team has changed massively from last season and that has changed what we're able to do. Just look at the front 3. A front 3 of Morris, Woodrow and Dike gives an opposition defence many more headaches. The press worked better with Mowatt and Chaplin involved and Ismael organising it. Our set pieces looked more effective with Mowatt delivery, Helik and Mads in tandem, along with Morris and Dike causing disruption.

Then we have the huge change in organisation on and off the field. Fitness, analysis, coaching, management, captaincy and experience all being negatively impacted.

Our recruits, though far too early to judge accurately have failed to make the impact Brittain, Morris and Dike had.

The replacements have all been thrown in at the deep end at the same time, and the coaching set up around the new head coach probably isn't what he'd ideally like.

So thats the backdrop we're having to endure. Throw in covid, niggly injuries and the call for experience being met with very young kids again and it doesn't make for a settled picture.

Having said that, the players we do have are looking a shadow in terms of energy and drive. They are running. But with less intensity. There were signs that Helik, Moon, Williams J and Palmer all gave up at certain times after they'd lost the ball, given it away or had been beaten and wrong sided. Thats unimaginable just a few months ago.

The back 3 is an absolute shambles. What's happened to Helik? He doesn't look interested and played key parts in the goals against but didn't seem to make up for it. And either side you've two players finding their way. Eager but hugely inexperienced. The result is a lack of definition of roles, shape and integrity. A high line with no recovery pace, and no midfield pressure on the ball. It's a disaster waiting to happen.

We had moments where we looked like we had some momentum. But when one simple pass or flick causes such damage, there is something fundamentally wrong and momentum can be lost in an instant. It did 3 times to some of the most embarrassingly easy goals I've seen, though that does discredit the pace, accuracy and drive that the Forest front 3 showed in the latter second half.

But perhaps the most dispiriting thing for me was to see Schopp abandon what he'd done against Stoke and mostly against QPR. Instead i saw a man who threw away his philosophy for one he doesn't respect or believe in and let it run for the best part of 90 minutes in a homage and desperate hope his predecessors influence could find something to get his team some points. And as a result, he could never possibly expect to mimic it successfully.

We're still early in the season, it's worrying for sure, but I've sympathy for Schopp. He's had everything mentioned to contend with without his preferred coaching team, the experience stripped out of the team and into a championship with fans in grounds and the added pressure.

I don't think getting rid of Schopp is the answer. But he needs to be brave and be the coach he believes himself to be. If 3-4-3 is something he can't make work, use the system you want to use. Be brave. Or events will overtake you. They may well do anyway.

 

Trouble is, he should’ve done that weeks ago, in fact right from the start. I fear it’s too late now. I can’t see the players adapting to what he wants them to do.

 

I can see why he took a more studious approach and looked to slowly change how the team played. He's a victim of circumstance though in many ways. He may not be helping himself, but I'm not sure there are huge amounts he can change other than the formation and shuffle the players he has until Mads and Morris are back.

 

I think just basic organisation and players knowing their roles would be a start. At least try and make us difficult to beat. For example, been vulnerable out wide all season and he’s done nothing to address it. Id support him if there were signs of improvement over time, but it’s going the other way.

 

I do think the players have to take responsibility too. Helik is now an international player. His performance and positioning at times was dire and put huge amounts of pressure on his younger defensive colleagues.

Though the head coach plays a part in where we are, he's not the sole contributor, and just changing coaches at this point doesn't seem like anything will mystically improve from doing that.

Morris and Mads will make a massive difference to this team, we'll see what transpires between now and when they are available again.

 

We have four fifths of a defence that was top five last season with Kitching by all accounts a reasonable stand in for Mads. Play those five in their positions of last year (not Styles or Brittain in centre mid) and you've at least solved part of our problem.
Accept that we don't have three fit goalscorers at the club and play three in midfield instead.
Then keep it simple, get em fit and motivate them. Short term it might help.

 

Yeah I was thinking has my views changed. 3 games ago I said we needed to see how the next 5 unfolded to know where we are. I don't see progression and in fact I have moved to 'patiently unhappy' to 'immediately worried'. This league is unforgiving and you get cut loose your gone. On reflection my biggest worry is that we have players we know can perform, we have potential in youth and team spirit and also strengthened in the squad. This will be at risk if we let things slide. Players like Helik will almost certainly look for an out of we are bottom three come Christmas. So my view is now more of what do we do next and when rather than how long do we carry on.

One problem is we have 2 coaches banned so the bench is already disrupted but I don't see that as a reason to wait.

 

I see this being posted a lot. Why does everyone think that Andersen and Morris are going to magically transform us? Seems like wishful thinking to me.

When we played out from the back under Struber, Andersen had to be rested for a few games at one point just to protect him, he was that bad.

And whilst I agree that Morris is a good player and would be an improvement on what we have, I can't see that he'd have massively altered last night against Forest. The u10s in midfield would still have got played through like they weren't even there, just like Jed Wallace will play through them on Saturday, for Miwawww.

 

Agree up to the last 2 paragraphs. You have made a good case for his sacking up to then. All the good work that has been done has been sacrificed sadly with a bloke who has no clear plan, intentions or way of motivating a football team. I'll drive him to the airport & wish him well, but he isn't cut out for it.

 

I didn't suggest it would magically turn things round... but Morris is our best forward who can hold the ball, manipulate it and bring players into play.

Mads is our best duelling centre half. The argument about his very early days are a little lazy in my view, he's played nearly 100 games and isn't the naive player we first brought in.

Their reintroduction instantly improves our starting 11. That can't be up for debate, surely? Whether Schopp is able to mould his team better, that's open to debate, but in terms of personnel, they would be a huge improvement.

 

I'm not sure Ismael would be doing that much better in all fairness. I suspect we'd be much more organised, but he'd still be trying to cover the losses of those key players and Mowatt and Dike still wouldn't be here.

I think Schopp is a little unlucky to be following him though. As much as I detested the style under Ismael when we had the ball, he was a winner. Schopp is much more laid back. Not something Barnsley people tend to like. So the contrast is stark.

We've also got fans back in stadia and the impatience and pressure.

There are a lot of factors. Don't get me wrong, i've some concerns, and Schopp has to be proactive to sort them. The defensive set up is the starting point for me. I'd actually drop Helik. I know some will find that controversial, but his body language and attitude last night was poor. I'd expect an international footballer who was player of the year and by far the most experienced in that back line to take charge and sort out the starting positions. Often, he was woefully out of position and the other 2 were scrambling to cover. I'd just drop him for one game, and see what his reaction was.

Thats not our sole problem obviously, I thought every player was poor. Though some showed more effort than others. Woodrow put a shift in and his penalty win and his shot 2nd half were all that was shown, though he'll get the usual stick from some quarters.

I just see no benefit sacking Schopp at this point. I can see it happening though, especially as Conway was in charge of summer transfers. He won't accept the blame for this state of affairs, obviously. So its obvious whos head wil be on the schopping block ;-)