A Leaderless Society

This is why I keep banging on about Proportional represention rather than our outdated system.
Our political system just seems to create extreme policies on both sides. And whichever aide you sit on such policies mean we have large numbers hugely against them.
If you look at the voting results then the reality is we are a fairly split nation. I would hope that a new system could be created where it was in everyone's interests to find the middle ground.
Sadly it's a fantasy as those in power will never reform a system that has put them into power.

 

Not a popular opinion but I actually think the club is always too slow sacking managers. I'd go a step further and say that some of the managers that we've received compo for were on the verge of the chop had they stayed a bit longer. Maybe our super dooper 2021 season would have been a relegation had Struber stayed? I don't think the players were playing for him before NY came in for him.

I too would like us to stick by a manager even if we get relegated until at least Christmas the following season. It's worked for Rotherham in spite of some shambolic seasons in the Championship.

I'd have given Morais and Asbaghi more time but that's just me. I feel when we sacked them the worst had already happened and it could only have got better. Not taking anything away from Stendel's fantastic season in charge but I could have coached that squad in League 1.

Top squad, cash in the bank and able to keep players on decent long term contracts. He dropped on big time.

 

Err, didn’t comment on the examples though did I?
The OP was making the point about whoever is in charge will be driven out.

 

Lose tonight and it will be like the Salem witch trials.

 

@SuperTyke come on pal please I am not or have ever bemoaned Boris Johnson leaving or Ashbagi. I didn't support either of them, read the post before replying or don't reply at all.

 

I have no solution just asking the question as if every leader is pushed out where does it stop.
I believe if Starmer gets in the the opposing masses and media will find ways to push him out. The last 2 PMs have been forced out, rightly or wrongly large sections of society disagree, it seems to me mob rule is taking over if things are not going their way.
If every BFC coach is sacked after less than a couple of years in the job how are they going to ever turn things round.
If we get promoted and have a bad start in the championship are we sacking Duff or going to give him time.

 

You have to stop shxt like this I am not going to accept it again.

 

The last 3 PM's left because of actions by Boris Johnson. That's not quite mob rule is it?

 

I would relish having a labour government next but I believe mob rule when in power Starmer will be forced to resign because the split in the country is big enough and the media strength is enough yo oust anyone and then its just move on to the next. Is anybody going to be good enough.

 

I think it's a large number of people's voices and media that have been the reason for PM s changing so frequently.

By the way Boris was a pillock who got loads of things wrong.

 

The last time we had a Labour government, it held in place for what, 13 years?

We have a very divided country, on that you are correct. But ask yourself why it is divided. You've correctly picked up on the media which has shifted further and further right in the last 20 years and will do in the next couple at least.

I don't think what you're describing is mob rule at all. Manipulation of a part of our countries population, yes, absolutely. Praying on unfounded fears and blaming groups that have no reason to be blamed. Yes. But the mob isn't driving government, far from it.

Our political system is an adversarial one. One island is based very much on us and them sliced hundreds of ways. It's been thus for a long time. Look at how many leaders have been ousted. Blair and Thatcher, the two longest serving in my lifetime were pushed by their own colleagues. Mobs did little to sway the political will of MP's want to progress their careers. Even 40+ years ago.

 

Err the Conservatives have been in power for 12 years.... Tory leaders maybe come and go but our national governance has been fairly consistent over those 12 years except for Brexit (which has clearly made things worse).

 

I very much disagree with you. I've never seen a PM propped up and defended as much as Johnson. His rightful place is in jail, and at a time when he should be helping the country, he's been gadding for 6 weeks and yesterday made jokes about people being able to get food at an event in the Downing St garden.

May was victim of Johnson and the far right nutters in her own party.
Cameron the same, but his position was untenable given his actions on the referendum.
Brown had to step aside at the insistence of Clegg to form a coalition... that never formed.
Blair made way for Brown after numerous coups from his factions.
Major lost a GE, so was removed by by democratic choice.
Thatcher was done for by her own MP's.

I don't see any mob rule there.

 

I don't think you can liken football managers to the PM, firstly. It is nuts how quickly teams go through managers, I agree with that. Much of last season's issues were down to having a poor team- the manager may not have done a good job either but that wasn't the reason we went down. I don't buy it. I don't think many top level managers would have kept us up last year.

As for the PM, we have never seen anything like what we have with Johnson. I won't go into it all because it has been covered extensively. The PMs before him were ousted due to infighting etc, it isn't a societal problem. Most people hate change and just want someone to try their best, be honest and do a good job.

 

Parties are governed by men who send little pieces of paper to the PM. When they get fed up. The said PM gets ousted. It's ran by the gentry. It's all about keeping the rich, rich and upholding a Status Quo. They all **** in the same pot. If you break it all back they're buddies playing politics. There's reference to this in the film about Churchill.

 

Totally agree with above and mob rule maybe the wrong turn of phrase, but I can't see a PM staying in the role any length of time which ever party is in place like Blair and Thatcher did.

 

They can if they do what their backbenchers want all the time. It's when they go against their mates from Eton that they end up in a mess.

 

I think the question should be, could a leader, now, stay in power for that length of time if they were popular with the electorate and peoples needs were largely being met.

Cameron was a poor leader. But got lucky that his time was largely quiet. If you look since then, Brexit, the pandemic and now war have created issues that would have been difficult to believe would happen in our lifetimes. That creates instability and fear and anger and dissent. If you then overlay poor political choices, even abdication of selecting choices and you make things worse.

There is nothing wrong with hoping, or trying to get rid of people who are unfit to hold the positions they do. Stability comes from the right people being in place and seeking to maintain that orthodoxy.

 

The downside of PR is they we would have upwards of 20 BNP mps in the 90’s and treble of UKIPpers lately. I’m not sure how as system that on the basis seems fair allows so many extremists a voice. the quest for centre allows the extreme?
Maybe it’s just me, I don't care much for the far right obviously and I’m glad they hadn’t been given a voice (until the Conservative party went full on far right) but I can’t see how PR, other than making every vote count makes things more centrist?

 

But in a true democracy they should have had that representation.
It may not make things more centrist, I'm not expert. However what I was thinking went along the lines of PR would likely give a hung parliament, hopefully this would lead to more balanced policy being voted through.
Or perhaps nothing would get done, because as politics has little to do with what's best for the people.