MU signing a 30 year old for £70 million

Discussion in 'Bulletin Board' started by Prince of Risborough, Aug 19, 2022.

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  1. Deafening Silence

    Deafening Silence Well-Known Member

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    I’ve read Ancelotti’s book and what I would say is that if he felt Casemiro was integral to his Real team he’d have convinced him to stay.
    Agree about Hourihane.
    Disagree that for a Brazilian at Real Madrid, Man Utd in 2022 is a new challenge.
     
    Deafening Silence, Aug 19, 2022
    #41
  2. Tyke The Tree-Frog

    Tyke The Tree-Frog Well-Known Member

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    The Hourihane comparison was about him being a cast off. Ancelotti didn't want to sell Casemiro, we didn't want to sell Hourihane. That was the only comparison I was trying to make. Hourihane wanted something new, Casemiro did. Both get more money. Same argument could be used with Lewandowski going Barcelona from Bayern. Why would he when Barcelona are in a shambles at the minute?
     
    Tyke The Tree-Frog, Aug 19, 2022
    #42
  3. Loko the Tyke

    Loko the Tyke Administrator Staff Member Admin

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    It might be when you’ve played there for nearly a decade and have won 15 medals. Experiencing new countries is one of the joys of choosing football as a career (for some).

    Your Ancelotti comment is speculation or your opinion. Saying he wanted him to stay isn’t.
     
    Loko the Tyke, Aug 19, 2022
    #43
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  4. Loko the Tyke

    Loko the Tyke Administrator Staff Member Admin

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    I never replied to you mate. You didn’t make the original Hourihane comparison.
     
    Loko the Tyke, Aug 19, 2022
    #44
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  5. man

    mansfield_red Well-Known Member

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    It's unlikely that he will be better at 31/32 than at 29/30. He'll be in physical decline and it's hard to argue otherwise. Do many Brazilians grow up idealising Man U? Even if they did, the current incarnation is so far removed from the Ferguson years that I doubt that's a substantial draw any more.

    Ozil, Sanchez and Aubameyang hadn't shown any signs of being mercenary until they got fat contracts in the later stages of their careers.

    You'd be daft if you said you don't think money is a substantial factor in this move. It's just a question of whether he is up for it, mentally and physically. He may well be, but that is undeniably a huge gamble given the sums involved.
     
    mansfield_red, Aug 19, 2022
    #45
  6. Deafening Silence

    Deafening Silence Well-Known Member

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    A manager of Ancelotti’s class speaking about a player who has given everything for Madrid over the last 10 or so years was never going to say that he wanted shut, or that the player wanted out.
    We could all do with having that level of class about players who come in or who go out of our club.

    I can’t think of any Brazilians who have played for the top clubs in La Liga who have come to the Premier League to better themselves.
    South Americans tend to play in Spain then go home to see out their careers unless they are chasing money like Robinho, Paulinho, Julio Baptista…
     
    Deafening Silence, Aug 19, 2022
    #46
  7. man

    mansfield_red Well-Known Member

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    For all those players the move made more sense from a footballing perspective and/or had more resale value for the buying club than it does for Casemiro and United.
     
    mansfield_red, Aug 19, 2022
    #47
  8. Tyke The Tree-Frog

    Tyke The Tree-Frog Well-Known Member

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    I understand your point about the resale and I don't disagree, but the reason I said that was in regards to players in their primes, who have come here and not performed. United know full well they won't get anything for him when he leaves, but they need someone in for the quick fix. That's why they've paid what they have. There should be absolutely no reason Casemiro shouldn't perform to his Madrid standards for the next 3 years minimum. Players in his position, De Rossi, Vidal, Pirlo all played some fantastic football when in their 30s. Theyve just got to trust that he will have the professionalism to apply himself and not let himself go, ala Robinho, Ronaldinho etc etc
     
    Tyke The Tree-Frog, Aug 19, 2022
    #48
  9. Loko the Tyke

    Loko the Tyke Administrator Staff Member Admin

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    We’ve had more Brazilians in the Premier League over the last five years or so than ever before. They’ve been coming here fairly early as well, but not always making the grade as anticipated. Marquinios turned down Madrid for Arsenal, I think? The success rate is greater in Spain, maybe due to the culture and environment, but we’re more popular.

    Ancelotti did say the player wanted out. He also said he didn’t want him to go but accepted those who agreed the deal. Now you’re speculating that really he wanted to sell him and he’s just a cast off, but that’s pure guess work right with no evidence to suggest you’re right? You might very well be right, but he evidence we have if we believe the words suggests you’re not.

    A 30 year old growing up in Brazil would loved through the Fergie years of Manchester United. Wouldn’t be surprising that there’s a fondness there as it’s still a massive club, going through a tough time. Manchester United’s problem now is that they haven’t been a force for a decade, so the young superstars with potential don’t see them in the same light as someone who was a teenager when they Premier League.
     
    Loko the Tyke, Aug 19, 2022
    #49
  10. Loko the Tyke

    Loko the Tyke Administrator Staff Member Admin

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    Fernandinho signed for Man City at 27 (I think) and stayed for ten years. I think years 4-8 for Citeh were his best and him at the peak of his powers.

    I’m not suggesting that is the case here with Casemiro, not at all, but to write him off and accuse him of chasing money only is very negative and a bit of an insult to someone who hasn’t displayed anything but a winner’s mentality his whole career.

    Every single signing is a risk. You don’t know how it will turn out, what will happen to confidence levels if things don’t go to plan immediately, or how the player will adapt to their new club.

    You’re choosing to focus on the what ifs in a negative light. But assuming the player continues his form of the last few years, yes it’s an a lot of money, but is hardly the worst deal of the Summer on that front, and he is exactly the player that club needed. For all the reasons pointed out in the earlier post. For some reason everything keeps coming back to him being a mercenary when he’s never displayed those traits, and ignoring everything that’s good about him as a footballer.
     
    Loko the Tyke, Aug 19, 2022
    #50
  11. man

    mansfield_red Well-Known Member

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    It comes back to him being a mercenary because it's difficult to see what the motivation to move would be apart from the money. I might be way off, and I concede it could be a fantastic transfer, but it's a huge gamble
     
    mansfield_red, Aug 19, 2022
    #51
  12. Mat

    Mateo Corbo Well-Known Member

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    Man u are in an absolute state at the minute and the glazers are fully responsible for the way the club has continued to fail. Glazer's early success was
    completely reliant on Ferguson's genius and they've failed to adapt the structure of the club to address his absence. I think Casemiro is clearly a panic signing. However, it's also a very very good one and exactly what they need. Probably in the top five defensive miss in the world at the moment and 30 isn't exactly old for a player in this position. There still seems to be a complete lack of planning throughout the club though and I can only really see them having success after the glazers leave.
     
    Mateo Corbo, Aug 19, 2022
    #52
  13. YT

    YT Well-Known Member

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    Money in football is stupid, we all know that by now. I remember as a kid being stunned when United signed Devante’s dad for £6,000,000 plus Keith Gillespie.

    But we are talking about one of the very best holding players in modern football and a serial winner. A proper sh1thouse to boot. In his prime.

    Seems a very good and obvious signing.

    I hope he’s dreadful and they get relegated, personally. But then, I hope the entire Premier League clubs go bust. So I’m biased.
     
    YT, Aug 19, 2022
    #53
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  14. Tyk

    Tyketical Masterstroke Well-Known Member

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    'Kalvin Phillips a similar player to Casemiro' is an interesti g comparison. To be fair to the poster they both have two legs and two eyes.

    On the other hand Casemiro has 5 champions league winners medals while Kalvin Phillips spent the summer getting drybummed across Molyneux by Callum Styles.
     
    Tyketical Masterstroke, Aug 19, 2022
    #54
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  15. Jack Tatty

    Jack Tatty Well-Known Member

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    They have spoffed billions over the years on individual "superstars ' and never learn.

    Veron
    Di Maria
    Tevez
    Rojo
    Schneiderlin
    Sanchez
    Pogba
    Varane
    Cavani
    Martial
    Lindelof
    Bailly
    Lukaku
    Mikhitaryan
    Maguire
    Sancho
    Felliani
    Wan-Bisaka
    Fred
    Fernandes
    Ronaldo's second coming

    And now Casemiro.

    Screams of clueless desperation.
     
    Last edited: Aug 19, 2022
    Jack Tatty, Aug 19, 2022
    #55
  16. Loko the Tyke

    Loko the Tyke Administrator Staff Member Admin

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    Does it? When they’re desperate for exactly this kind of player. I’m not sure they were desperate for the names you mentioned.
     
    Loko the Tyke, Aug 19, 2022
    #56
  17. Loko the Tyke

    Loko the Tyke Administrator Staff Member Admin

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    It’s still Manchester United. They’re still a huge football club on the world stage. When you’ve won everything there is to win, why is a new challenge being brushed off as not being motivation? To experience living in England, with possibly the last chance you’ll get at a four year contract at one of the biggest clubs in the world.
     
    Loko the Tyke, Aug 19, 2022
    #57
  18. Loko the Tyke

    Loko the Tyke Administrator Staff Member Admin

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    Massive Peter Kay and ‘Stars in Your Eyes’ vibes here.

    ‘You’ve got a lot in common with who you’re going to be tonight haven’t you’
    ‘Yes Matthew. As we have both got heads’
     
    Loko the Tyke, Aug 19, 2022
    #58
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  19. Jack Tatty

    Jack Tatty Well-Known Member

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    Im giving examples of the money they have wasted by paying stupid fees.
     
    Jack Tatty, Aug 19, 2022
    #59
  20. Loko the Tyke

    Loko the Tyke Administrator Staff Member Admin

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    You have. I’ve also pointed out they didn’t really need those players at the time. A player like Casemiro they absolutely need and have paid the same as they were going to pay for De Jong.

    I know which player I’d rather have based on performances.

    As an aside, they didn’t waste money on Tevez as he was brilliant for them. I’d probably stand Cavani’s corner as well.
     
    Loko the Tyke, Aug 19, 2022
    #60
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