Is it fair to blame protesters here..?

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/horse-racing/65296693

 

Blame them for a horse's death in the Grand National?

The race is dangerous, trainers and riders etc all know that, a bit pathetic really.

 

My thoughts too. Literally states how many deaths there's been since 2012, so not entirely sure why he feels justified in assigning blame on this one.

 

It's really, really desperate stuff from the racing lobby this morning. All about the (huge) money involved. Let's face it, without betting/gambling, horse-racing simply wouldn't exist.

 

Should we give the protesters what they want and ban horse racing?

Its disgraceful what the protesters did and certainly caused additional stress and anxiety to all involved which would have been a contributing factor.

 

It’s a bit strong to pin sole blame on them. A bit rich too as horses die on track at this festival most years.

But to be fair to the trainer I suggested myself before they went off that the delay caused by the protestors would probably have unsettled the horses, and that there’d be fallers or refusals at the first fence due to it. Sadly one of those led to a fatal injury.

You can never say with certainty that the protestors caused the incident no - but you can’t say they didn’t contribute to it either.

Horses do die on track in racing. That’s not nice but it is true. Mostly euthanised due to severe injuries in falls but there have been heart attacks etc to some horses.

A racehorse is hugely more likely to die in a field, or being ridden out, or being transported, than it is on track however. I understand the protestors doing what they think was right, I don’t agree with them and they went too far beyond a peaceful protest in my eyes, though I’d never deny someone a voice to give their view whether it matches mine or not - but I think they need a bit more understanding as well. It was ill thought out.

I agree that their actions might have led to the fallers at the first, remember it wasn’t just Hill 16 that went down, just his fall was particularly bad, some will have seen but I’m not going to describe further, as he messed up the jump completely, bless him. Did the disruption and delay contribute to that? Was the horse spooked by it? Was the jockey fully switched on? It’s fair to say it’s possible, more than possible, I’d say it was a contributing factor, though I wouldn’t go as far as to put sole blame there. Maybe the trainer’s words will prevent them going so militant in future. If they honestly thought they could stop the race then there’s no defending their idiocy and naivety - if the aim was just to cause disruption and draw attention then the disruption they sought disrupted the horses and jockeys too, which can have consequences.

I’d say the trainer isn’t the only one within racing circles and outside them that is thinking that, though I’d imagine some would choose their words more carefully and have a less polar view.

 

Isn't that just due to the fact they spend very little of their lives actually on track? It's like saying a BASE jumper is more likely to die in his house than BASE jumping - it's factually true but it's a misrepresentation of relative risk.

Say a horse is actively racing for a combined total of 3 hours in its lifetime. It's not just as likely to die in a 3 hour window of time in a field, is it?

 

No.

I didn’t mean deaths by any cause including old age, natural causes, illnesses etc. I perhaps should have clarified or explained better.

I meant more likely to die in a field or being ridden out etc particularly due to a fall, incident or accident than they are on track. Time on track compared to anywhere else doesn’t come into it, a horse will run and jump of its own accord and it can be shown that they are much more likely to suffer a fatal injury in those manners - for each individual time a horse takes a jump it is less likely they will fall and be injured on a track with a pro jockey riding than when they just do it for themselves - horses have been found lying near jumps or fences when left to pasture and have had to be shot. So yes they are in fields and stables and ridden out massively more often than they are on track - but that’s not what I was referring to.

Look, people have different views on everything in life so I’ve no desire to influence your thinking on racing, but I’m not in agreement that racing is a sport that is inherently cruel.

 

I don't want to ban racing, but the Grand National is a disgrace. So many horses die. Those protesters were in the right.

 

Do you have a source on the "more likely to injure jumping in a field bit" please? I'd be interested to read it.

 

Think there are dozens of horses who die due to the fright of bonfire night and New Year’s Eve fireworks,are we banning them,are we banning dog food,10.000 horses a year in the UK are killed for pet food ,why not ban every single thing and we all live in a big plastic bubble

 

From what I can find the number of slaughtered horses is nowhere near that high, they aren't permitted to be used in pet food, and a large proportion of the ones that are slaughtered are injured/surplus racing horses...

 

Absolutely spot on, I said before the off ,the horses looked rattled.
I have never seen such carnage in all the years watching the race.
I agreeabout the field being too large.
There needs to be mediation about making it safer.
The protesters have a right to protest.
Trying to stop it created carnage.

 

That sounds like the statistic that the average human has more than one skeleton and more than one brain - at any one time, a sizeable group of women are pregnant and count as having two which pushes the average up.

 

1967 Fionaven Beechers Brook carnage

 

Even if your first two sentences were true, it wouldn’t make the last one right.

They had a right to protest - but what they did in the manner they did wasn’t right.

 

Will they be protesting at Kelso today or outside Halal/kosher slaughter houses

 

In fairness it’s more anecdotal and from experience, never had racehorses but have had horses in the family. These things are notoriously hard to quantify and there are much more published stats about deaths in racing itself, but there’s a university study published in an old independent article here :

https://www.independent.co.uk/sport...g-fatal-deadly-cruel-injury-a7704086.html?amp

Which says: Liverpool University found that 62% of ‘traumatic injuries’ suffered by leisure and competition horses occurred when they are turned out in a field. Ridden exercise accounted for 13%.

That doesn’t really qualify what I said though to be fair.

 

Course they wont.

One question though. What difference does it make if the slaughterhouse is halal or kosher? The means might be slightly different but the end result the same.