Forward line looking weak.

I'm not doubting at all that if you throw a lot of money at a club, gift it to them, then the club can be successful. There's loads of examples. Although there are equally as many examples where throwing money at it has achieved nothing. But that's not speculating to accumulate, which was the point I specifically questioned.

'Speculate to Accumulate' is often thrown at the owners, as though this is what other owners are doing, and that it's a realistic strategy in modern football. They're not, they're simply financing clubs with no hope of getting any of the money back. What people mean when they say speculate to accumulate is, "I want us to have a sugar daddy that will bank-roll the club". I wish they'd just say that.

I do concede there is the potential that the Glaziers have made a lot of money out of Man Utd. But I believe that situation is unique. Usually, it's the case of if you want to become a millionaire, start off as a billionaire and buy a football club.

 

No it isn't. That is absolutely not what people are asking for. Stop with the strawman. You couldn't be more wrong, there is an absolutely huge gap between "speculate to accumulate" and being bank rolled. It isn't black and white, like you suggest and it's completely disingenuous to suggest it is.

For example it would have been nice to speculate some more of the transfer fees we received last summer into the first team squad. That is not being bank rolled at all. It might actually stop us from being bank rolled long term, as we might actually have some assets to sell. Rather than dross like Shaw and Dallas. That's a major part of why we need the owners to cover our losses because we waste money on the cheap options. Which leaves us with 3 year liabilities in wages and absolutely no chance of turning a profit on a player

It is not black and white as you suggest.

 

The problem with us is say the Mansfield player (Dunn?) is valued by them at let’s say £750k, we’ve clearly gone in with our first bid at something stupid like £100k, which is never going to be accepted, so instead of us going back in with a serious offer we’ll end up upping it to £150k, which begs the question, why are we targeting such players if we aren’t going to meet their valuation, or at least put in a serious offer?

 

I know what my money's on...

 

I don’t know anything, I’m just speculating what has most likely happened in my opinion based on how amateur we’ve been run over the years, especially with Transfer drama, Stevie Mallan’s bid going to the wrong email address, Mcburnies deadline day fax debacle etc…

 

You have no idea how much we've bid for him. Maybe Mansfield are holding out for daft money, like we did with Kitching?

Shaw was a very weird signing. Dallas actually looked pretty good for the few minutes we saw him, and judging by his stats he was well worth a punt. Overall, our recruitment is pretty good. It's not an exact science, especially at the level where we're shopping. In any case, spending a lot on players hasn't always worked out either. Herbie Kane, Josh Benson, Malik Wilks and Luke Thomas all cost around the million quid mark, and we're quite seriously out of pocket on them.

Pinnock, Kitching, Mads, Woodrow, Morris, Roberts were all signed for much less, in Pinnock's and Robbo's cases from the National League, and all made major contributions on the field before being sold for very healthy profits.

 

I said this the other week in another thread. We seem to do it every summer. No point targeting a player if we’ve no intention of making a serious offer anywhere near the player’s value.

 

I'm changing my tune now, let's go for it.
The owners should put £20m in for 3 strikers a left back a left wing back if we switch formations and a goal keeper.
Hopefully we will gain enough points so a deduction doesn't impact our automatic promotion.

If it doesn't work and we go bankrupt then hey ho we can find something else to do on a Saturday.

If you are not as gung ho as me then we try just asking all the good players if they will come cos the Barnsley fans deserve better.
If £20m is too much then how much do we spend to guarantee success there must be a number?

I know we all want good quality recruitment within our budget or we want rich people to give us money to get promotion but not sure how easy that is or everyone would do it but anyway our forward line looks weak.

 

So you’re speculating negatively.
big surprise. I’m not sure what “transfer drama” is? And then you pull 2 examples that were under previous ownership. Classic.

 

I don't think Collins got the best out of Cosgrove not saying it's conclusive proof but he looked like a different player in the playoffs once he'd left. One of Clarke's strong points is man management a fully motivated Cosgrove will be a handful for any defence at our level.

 

Okay then, Oulare & Iseka. Oli Shaw. The Marsh farce last year, we didn’t even seem to know the rules! Need I go on?

I would much rather the club be transparent & say we haven’t got much of a transfer budget to be bidding for players, & instead use any funds towards wages, or loan fee’s, cos let’s be real, that’s where we’re at!

 

I think we’ll end up picking a premier league or championship loan, fingers crossed it’s a good un!

 

I think we maybe have different versions of speculate. You are right some crazy people think chucking millions around is the answer. It obviously isn’t for a club like ours. At the same time we have failed to support good managers like Duff and Robins which contributed to them leaving. Also instead of targeted signings we seem to have gone back to some scattergun approach. This has left us with about 484235 centre halves of which 2 are half decent.

Lots of owners could cash out. Ipswich could for example spend nothing get relegated trouser the tv money then rouse the parachute payments. They choose not to. We can question those choices but the opportunity is there

 

Oulare and Iseka were also under previous ownership. Not sure what the Oli shaw thing is (other than not announcing he’d left, which wouldn’t impact anything anyway!).
I agree the fa cup thing was a farce.
Could you go on? You’ve only offered one thing about the current ownership and that wasn’t to do with transfers anyway.

I do agree that we are where we are but the club aren’t exactly going to advertise that. For reasons we all understand.

 

My point is there’s been a culture of poor business relating to transfers in one way or another throughout the club over the years, regardless of who the owners were. This current lot aren’t doing a great deal to change anything.

 

Your point was some nonsense about how we might or might not have been trying to sign a player.

 

Yes that's where we are at, did you think it was any different?

 

But that's not what I'm arguing, if that happens again that means you've got a problem with your recruitment not with shackling yourself financially.

I'm suggesting that us not being willing to invest in the squad is ultimately leading to a gradual decline in quality of squad, resale value and balance sheet.

If you waste that money, that's poor recruitment, that then becomes your issue. Not what our issue is currently where we are slowly declining in quality of squad, due to imo a lack of investment in the playing squad. You can always and people will say, "Oh but Reading... But Wigan, but Wednesday, but Derby".

I'm not arguing that we should spend big on stupid signings like those clubs have/did. I think we've fundamentally hamstrung ourselves by not being willing to back our recruitment team to find better players, who may well cost that bit more and be a more risky purchase.
If we do allow it and we waste money that is a separate issue, not related to investment but poor recruitment and decision making.

I think it's widely regarded and I agree, that our recruitment is on the whole, pretty decent. Now if that's the case and the board feels the same, we should back them to bring in real quality which comes at a premium but it's already been established on a shoestring they generally do well. Why not give them that opportunity to kick on a step.

Don't forget we're haemorrhaging millions every year we stay in this division.

I'm not disagreeing, I just think investment and recruitment should be viewed as two very separate issues.

 

So basically, what you want, is someone to put a load of money into the club and for us to always sign players that are much better than the players other teams sign, and if that doesn't happen, that person who put that money in should be sacked, and someone else should be brought in to put all their money in. Have I understood you correctly?