I cant think of words I can use for people who make no attempt to save a drowning boy because its more than their jobsworth. From Tiscali news site Call to scrap PCSOs after drowning 21/09/2007 17:04 Police Community Support Officers should be scrapped as a "failed experiment" in the wake of a 10-year-old boy drowning as two PCSOs stood by, a Police Federation boss has said. The PCSOs arrived at the scene of the emergency at a pond in Wigan, Greater Manchester, but did not attempt to rescue Jordon Lyon and called for further assistance from uniformed officers. The youngster was pulled from the water up to five minutes after the call for help was made by the PCSOs. A bid was made to resuscitate Jordon but he was later pronounced dead at hospital. Greater Manchester Police defended their actions and said they were right not to jump in the water because they were not trained in such incidents. Paul Kelly, chairman of the Police Federation in Manchester said PCSOs were not capable of dealing with emergency situations. He said: "The public are being fooled. We are sending people out there who are dressed as police officers. "Every single police officer that went to training school with me 30 years ago left with a life-saving certificate of some sort. I don't know in this case if the two PCSOs could not swim but not swimming was not an option in our training. "We've got to able to deal with all types of situations. We should do away with PCSOs because they are a failed experiment. "In Greater Manchester we have taken on up to 400 PCSOs in the last 18 months but in the same period have reduced the number of police officers by more than 200. We should be investing in more police officers." Jordon's mother, Tracy Lyon, has called for the PCSOs to be named after they were not asked to give evidence at her son's inquest. Speaking from her home in Bluebell Avenue, Wigan, Mrs Lyon said the PCSOs involved should lose their jobs. She said: "If you're walking down the street and you see a child drowning you automatically go in that water. You don't care if you're going to lose your job or not."
IfI were the lad's parent I would be absolutely gutted that people of such visible authority and responsibility were unwilling or unable to help.</p> We are a nationparalysed by political correctness and H&S gone absolutely beserk. </p> We are a society in decline. It would be laughable if it wasn't do bloody heartbreaking.</p>
I agree that I think they should have helped, however, do we know if these 2 could swim or not? Also, as someone said on Radio 5, did anyone ask why some men fishing nearby didn't jump in?
SO IF IT WENT WRONG AT THERE WAS MORE THAN 1 DEATH WOULD YOU BE HAVNG THIS POST I DONT AGREE WITH NOT HELPING BUT soz brt caps cba to change it
No, maybe not but that doesn't change the fact that they should try and help. As the spokesman says in the interview if it were a policeman that was there they would have had to have jumped in. I would like to think that I would do something, and I work in the world of local govt finance.
i would also like to say i would jump in but theres always that seed of doubt in your mind for your own safety
But from the comments it doesn't sound like it was particularly dangerous. It sounds like they have felt unable to do anything because of their lack of 'training' and subsequent powers. "Oh, it's an emergency, sorry we can't deal with emergencies". Anybody in such a position, that is seen as authority in the community, and wants to be treat as authority, should at least have basic life skills, like swimming for instance. I will bet they can write nice.
it did say on the news that the little lad would have already been dead by the time they got there, its a terrible tradgedy but sometimes all the bickering which follows such occurences doesnt really help anyone, obviously i dont know the full facts, just reporting what it said in a news bulletin which went further than most on this story
When I worked in the care home for the Alzheimer sufferers, I basically had to stand and watch a lady die as we were not allowed to resuscitate. Our sue for anything society put the rubber stamp on that!</p> </p> The Vets at work have often mentioned how they can be prosecuted if they offer medical assistance at an accident or emergency. It's chuffing bonkers! I would like to think that anyone that was physically able to would be in a position to offer me assistance should I require it without having to risk their chuffing job! </p>
VERY DEPRESSING..... but.... well, no buts really. fecking spineless human beings. It'll haunt them forever though. a year ago a lad at work collapsed at work and stopped breathing. I gave him mouth to mouth and he came back round. I'd never been 1st aid trained yet i dived in. After he'd been off sick fro a couple of weeks he sued my employer because i attempted to save his life (and did so) yet i wasn't first aid trained and in his words "put his life in jeopardy". If it happened again i'd do the same (blagger)
Been like that years. My mum was a Ward Sister at a hospital, if there was a road accident she would help if nobody else about, however if a first aider was there then she'd leave them to it as she stood to be struck off the medical register if anything went wrong, nothing to do with being sued.
In Minasotta (sp?) USA, it's a criminal offence not give aid and assistance to someone involved in an accident or in need. The world has gone fookin bananas.
They did, they saved the sister! and the wanna be pigs said they couldnt see the boy, but IF the spineless bast tids had of jumped in where the little girl was saved at least they would have had a rough idea where to dive for the boy..
There was a case a few years ago where a Nurse gave someone CPR on the Street. The person survived but sued because a couple of ribs were broken. The nurse was sacked because he/she did not have a First Aid qualification. If ever we are out and some one needs help I give assistance because even though my Wife is a nurse she could be sued and lose her job if some thing goes wrong. I am ok to help provided I only do what I was trained to do on the Emergency First Aid course. The course I did was only 3 hours long, my wife has 30 years + experience and works on a surgical ward. I know which of us I would want to help if I needed it.
Nursing used to be same but NMC now say nurses must offer 'any assistance they are competent to give' So even if your **** faced you should try to assist So for us its potentially be sued or be struck off
personally from what little info Ive seen I blame the system more than them ie anybody patrolling that area should have been a strong swimmer and competent to deal with any likeley problems.If neither of them were strong swimmers you can't really blame them for not going in.Its really sad but seems Ive read too many articles in the last few years where some well meaning soul has jumed in to help somebody or something (dogs) and theyve either both ended up drowning or the would be rescuer drowned and their intended rescuee got out.
PCSOs 'did not watch boy drown' </p> </p> Assistant Chief Constable Dave Thompson defended the PCSOs after the death of Jordon Lyon, who drowned in a pond in Wigan, Greater Manchester, on 3 May. </p> He said officers were not expected to rescue people from water and they could not see where Jordon was in the lake. </p> Instead, the PCSOs summoned extra help and made sure emergency services could locate the scene. </p> Jordon had leapt into the water at John Pit after his eight-year-old stepsister Bethany got into difficulties as they collected tadpoles. </p> He was trying to support Bethany as she struggled in the six-feet-deep water before slipping from view. </p> Two anglers waded in and pulled Bethany to safety using their rods but Jordon became submerged. </p> The alarm was raised and the PCSOs arrived. Police said they could see no sign of Jordon in the water, so they radioed trained officers for help. </p> Jordon's stepfather Anthony Ganderton also arrived on the scene and he plunged into the water. </p> Mr Thompson said they would not encourage any police officer to jump into the water because of the dangers and he paid tribute to the PCSOs for "acting correctly". </p> But he insisted: "The two PCSOs involved did not stand by and watch Jordon die. </p> <table cellspacing="0" cellpadding="0" width="203" align="right" border="0"><tbody><tr><td><div> <div class="cap">The pond is at a well-known beauty spot in Wigan</div></div></td></tr></tbody></table></p> "They acted correctly and I fully support the actions they took. </p> "The initial call to police gave the wrong location. This was no-one's fault, as the lake is known by several different names locally and there are other similar lakes nearby. </p> "The PCSOs managed to establish the correct location and immediately informed the control room to ensure the emergency services were sent there. </p> "One PCSO cycled to the road to alert other emergency services as they headed to the scene, while the other remained at the lake. </p> "Again it is important to stress that Jordon had not been seen for some time before their arrival. The inquest established that, tragically, at the time of the PCSOs' arrival, Jordan was probably dead. </p> "We do not encourage police and PCSOs to carry out this kind of underwater rescue. They are not trained in this type of rescue, which is fraught with danger. </p> <table cellspacing="0" cellpadding="0" width="203" align="right" border="0"><tbody><tr><td><div> <div class="cap">Mrs Ganderton wants the PCSOs to be named</div></div></td></tr></tbody></table></p> "Everyone involved in this incident has been deeply affected and saddened by the loss of a young life." </p> Jordon's mother Tracy Ganderton, of Bluebell Avenue, Wigan, is demanding to know why the PCSOs did not try to rescue Jordon and why they did not give evidence at the inquest held by deputy West Manchester coroner Alan Walsh on Friday. </p>