Will Mandela Gardens have to be renamed?

Discussion in 'Bulletin Board' started by Mr Badger, Jun 10, 2020.

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  1. Mr Badger

    Mr Badger Well-Known Member

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    Or Victoria Station?
    If your mind works in a certain direction then sadly everything is under scrutiny.
    We are tomorrow's history don't forget.
    One or two hundred years ago people were themselves making history and thought little of it. They lived for their present.
    We cannot delete history because it suits us now. It happened and can't be changed. We can accept that a lot of it was, with hindsight, wrong but we have built our lives based on what has gone before.
    We can't delete the Bible, the Norman invasion, Henry the Eighth, the Spanish Inquisition, the two world wars, etc etc but we can accept that they happened, learn from them and move on and not try to play the holier-than-thou card.
    He who is without sin .... (let him pull down the first statue)
     
    Mr Badger, Jun 10, 2020
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  2. Mid

    Mido Well-Known Member

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    Are you really comparing Mandela to a slave owner?!
     
    Mido, Jun 10, 2020
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  3. Redhelen

    Redhelen Well-Known Member

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    Now I know the next thing that will be doing the social media rounds!
     
    Redhelen, Jun 10, 2020
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  4. North Yorks Red

    North Yorks Red Well-Known Member

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    people do tend to forget he was a seriously nasty fkr before he reformed his views
     
    North Yorks Red, Jun 10, 2020
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  5. Lor

    Lordtyke Well-Known Member

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    There's always several sides to every story-especially on here!
    One person's freedom fighter is another person's terrorist.
    Mandela rightfully fought the odious apartheid regime in South Africa, yet also sanctioned MK (ANC military wing) attacks on security forces which killed 19 of them.
    Unfortunately 52 innocent civilians were also killed during these attacks and car bombings. They were mostly black people, I wonder what their grieving relatives thought of Nelson Mandela?
    He also advocated cutting off the noses of black people who were deemed to be collaborators with the regime, or witnesses at ANC members trials, and his wife was a big advocate of the "necklace"

    It's not always a clear cut issue of who are the saints and who are the sinners is it?

    Best is to not erect statues at all, and to name every street after something innocuous
     
    Lordtyke, Jun 10, 2020
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  6. Sup

    Superhiggy Well-Known Member

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    Do we demolish the collaseum in rome and all the roman settlements in britain,where does this end.All the countries in the world have history and thankfully we learn.But, and i am not racist one bit, history is history.The same thing has happened with comedy programmes over the years.
     
    Superhiggy, Jun 10, 2020
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  7. arabian_ian

    arabian_ian Well-Known Member

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    Fools and horses must be taken off our screens because Del lives in Mandela House which should be demolished.
     
    arabian_ian, Jun 10, 2020
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  8. icer

    icer Well-Known Member

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    History is something we all learn from. Whether it's good things, bad things or both depending on your view. So i believe that the street names and statues, buildings etc shouldn't all, necessarily be removed or renamed (some of course should). But there should be a recognition of what the history was either with plaques, museum locations for statues, explanations on street signs etc. Make it a more transparent learning opportunity. Rather than defacing, ripping down and destroying history, make it a symbol of something not to be tolerated or pivotal in how it influenced history.
     
    icer, Jun 10, 2020
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  9. E3R

    E3Red Well-Known Member

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    These days, if you say you're English, you'll be arrested and thrown in jail.

     
    E3Red, Jun 10, 2020
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  10. Lor

    Lordtyke Well-Known Member

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    Gone with The Wind.........

    Gone...as it depicts slavery aspects, removed from HBO streaming
     
    Lordtyke, Jun 10, 2020
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  11. Mid

    Mido Well-Known Member

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    Oh trust me I’m not saying he was a saint, I went to Cape Town at Christmas so it gave me chance to learn about him and apartheid etc. But there’s a lot of difference between him and the slave scum from Bristol.
     
    Mido, Jun 10, 2020
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  12. Stephen Dawson

    Stephen Dawson Well-Known Member

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    Should stately homes be pulled down and turned into nature reserves and the contents of them be auctioned off?
     
    Stephen Dawson, Jun 10, 2020
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  13. arabian_ian

    arabian_ian Well-Known Member

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    Absolutely. Auction off the contents and use the proceeds for the NHS then turn the stately homes into accommodation for the homeless.
     
    arabian_ian, Jun 10, 2020
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  14. Stephen Dawson

    Stephen Dawson Well-Known Member

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    There are some beautiful buildings. I'd go along with them being used for good rather than being pulled down. Makes more sense what you put mate.
     
    Stephen Dawson, Jun 10, 2020
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  15. arabian_ian

    arabian_ian Well-Known Member

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    I would begin with Buck House.
     
    arabian_ian, Jun 10, 2020
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  16. Stephen Dawson

    Stephen Dawson Well-Known Member

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    I just googled that :D
     
    Stephen Dawson, Jun 10, 2020
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  17. Farnham_Red

    Farnham_Red Administrator Staff Member Admin

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    I read that this morning and its just a decision thats too stupid for words.
    Yes Its a film that depicts slavery in an unrealistic light - but in 1939 no one thought there was much wrong with the film. There is a huge leap from taking down a statue of a slave trader - and moving it to a museum to removing a film from view.
    It also plays into the hands of the racists as it will be used as propaganda to point out how bad it is to give in to this "politically correct rubbish" in much the same way as out Daily Heil picks up on the odd numpty who band christmas decorations in case it causes offence
     
    Farnham_Red, Jun 10, 2020
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  18. Mr Badger

    Mr Badger Well-Known Member

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    I think you are getting the gist of my original post. Good.
    Then the deeper you look into it all the dafter it appears.
    I'd like to add as one of my historical items that had there been no slave trade there probably wouldn't have been black africans in the USA, therefore no black/white racism, no KKK, no Martin Luther King, no blues. History leaves us with some very peculiar consequences.
    You get my drift even if I'm being very simplistic in how I say it, or even if I'm saying it properly.
     
    Mr Badger, Jun 10, 2020
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  19. Terry Nutkins

    Terry Nutkins Well-Known Member

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    You can delete the bible.

    It’s just a story.

    *Although I may be made to repent that claim at a later date.
     
    Terry Nutkins, Jun 10, 2020
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  20. Sel

    Selby Red Active Member

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    Barbary pirates took white slaves from all around Europe in the fifteenth century.Civilisation. has been built on slavery from the start of mankind .
     
    Selby Red, Jun 10, 2020
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