Wigan Fans again :)

Apparently they are seeking to be represented at our appeal as an interested party. I fail to see how they can be. Whilst I accept they would be affected by the result it isn’t a dispute between the two clubs as the actual offence has nothing to do with them as we are challenging the legality of the efl imposed penalty. I’m not sure what their argument would be - yeah we’ve been in the relegation zone for ten months but we deserve to stay up even though Wigan got ten points more than us and even though they had more points than we have now when they went into admin!

Regulations are open to interpretation given the pandemic. Whether we have committed the offence or not the imposition of the penalty on the 19/20 season is certainly up for debate.

12.3.3 Subject to the provisions of Regulation 12.3.4 below, where the Club becomes subject to or suffers an Insolvency Event, or the Board impose a deduction in accordance with Regulation 12.3.2:
(a) during the Normal Playing Season but prior to 5.00pm on the fourth Thursday in March, the points deduction shall apply immediately;
(b) during the Normal Playing Season but after 5.00pm on the fourth Thursday in March, Regulation 12.3.4 shall apply; and
(c) outside the Normal Playing Season, the points deduction shall apply in respect of the following Season such that the Club starts that Season on minus 12 points (including in the National League if appropriate).

As per (c) we are clearly outside the normal playing season - that should have ended on May 1st or at worst end of June given season runs July to June. We understood those conditions when entered the competition in August. Whilst I accept the season has been extended due to covid - a force majure event - the argument is it is outside the normal playing season, particularly in light of all other changes that have taken affect since. A QC could quite successfully argue this point - so whilst they state ‘normal season’ are games prior to play offs and they’ll argue that - has this actually been communicated or does this unprecedented event effectively null and void this? Effectively the argument is an interpretation of the regulations but don’t forget we aren’t convincing the efl of this but an independent chairperson. If the force majure event hadn’t happened the 19/20 wouldn’t be ongoing in July. I accept its not wiping the points and that we’d be screwed next season in the Championship with a points penalty next season but financially we’d be much better off and would allow us to be bought. Furthermore if they’ve incorrectly applied them should they have a second chance to reissue them when it’s the same admin???

Looks like they really do believe that the dates involved is the reason they'll win their appeal.

 

I have been watching their forums really closely since Wednesday night, and the rumour is that it's Dave Whelan who has stumped up the £500k. I guess their forums know as little as everyone else, but that's the rumour anyway.

 

From the FA Standardised Rulebook: "“Playing Season” means the period between the date on which the first league fixture in the Competition is played each year until the date on which the last league fixture in the Competition is played."
http://www.thefa.com/~/media/Files/...es-of-the-association/standardised-rules.ashx

 

If that argument is upheld then the EFL can expect to here from Tranmere Rovers on the grounds that their season never finished I would think
A new day an new excuse

 

You'll not find a funnier quote from someone claiming to be an expert on the rules than "we are clearly outside the normal playing season - that should have ended on May 1st or at worst end of June"

I'd love to see that idiot in court. "Well your majesty (in phoenix nights style)"it's obviously outside the normal playing season which ends on may 1st erm or end of June Im not sure which but it's definitely one of those. I think"

 

I'm sure it's just clutching at straws stuff but it does appear to be their reasoning.

 

Clutching at straws. When clubs voted to extend the season and not Void it, each individual club will have had to agree to extend the Season incorporating the whole rules until the last match has been played of the season. Not just the financial element but disciplinary, even the rules changed to the number of substitutes that could be used etc. They were doomed as soon as the owners put them into admin and rescinded their financial support.

 

Or lack of

 

They're ignoring a regulation quoted in that statement. I.e. it's applied next season if they would've already been relegated...

https://www.efl.com/-more/governance/efl-rules--regulations/section-3---the-league/
"
12.3.4 Where the circumstances set out in Regulation 12.3.3(b) apply and at the end of that Season, having regard to the number of championship points awarded (ignoring any potential deduction):

(a) the Club would be relegated in accordance with Regulation 10.1.2(b) or 7.7, the points deduction will apply in the next following Season (including in the National League if appropriate); or

(b) the Club would not be relegated as aforesaid, the points deduction will apply in that Season and Regulation 10.1.2(b) or 7.7 will then apply (if appropriate) following imposition of the points deduction.
"

 

I’m only bringing this up because it often gets said that we only stayed up due to Portsmouth’s points deduction.

That season they got the points took off early in the season & the bottom 3 were cast adrift. We were giving games to youngsters & on the beach from March.

There was never any danger of us going down. In fact we were in the mix for the play offs in January but lost Vaz Te & Drinkwater to other clubs & Perkins & Butterfield to long term injuries within the month.

 

https://forums.vitalfootball.co.uk/threads/barnsley-club-statement.106724/

Not a fan of us are they. Another weird one where a club from outside of Yorkshire that are insignificant are going to now hate us forever like Peterborough fans do.

 

I love it when we make enemies. Because it's always because of the mentality that: yeah we royally f***** up, but we're bigger than "little old barnsley" so they should suffer instead.

 

https://forums.vitalfootball.co.uk/threads/does-the-town-deserve-a-team.106713/

Even they know how tinpot they are.

 

Think creditors have stumped up 500k for a QC to look after there money owed.

 

This. It's a defined term - there's no scope for arguing that it was outside the Normal Playing Season. If it was undefined "normal playing season" then perhaps, but it isn't.

 

I think that's a very honest exchange. They have been subsidised for so long many don't understand the harsh reality.

 

There's a lot of ***** on there. Take this:


That's complete ********. The bar has what's known as the "cab rank rule" whereby barristers are obliged to accept instructions which fall within their competency. The rationale is that without it undesirable people (or people with weak cases) could be effectively denied representation.

 

I’m going to show my age now but I vaguely remember the ‘big freeze of 1963’ and this thread prompted me to read up a little about it. It stopped football in its tracks for 13 weeks - no undersoil heating back then. Though not necessarily comparable to the pandemic I thought the following little extract interesting

The disruptions caused, inevitably, many distortions, but one of the unlikeliest was Fulham's. George Cohen, later to be England's winning World Cup right-back, recalls: "When the freeze struck we were in danger of relegation. Luckily we were able to go and train at the ground of Leatherhead FC, near to where I lived at Chessington. When the thaw arrived, we went 13 weeks without defeat and moved to safety."

Just goes to show that this situation is not totally without precedent