London Imperial College Vaccine

I didn't call you ignorant. My suggestion was that you were ignorant of the facts and harsh realities (in context say with someone who was lost because they were 'ignorant' of the geography of the area). I would argue that people with views like yours are hugely damaging to our chances of recovery though.

 

Never let a good crisis go to waste.

https://www.weforum.org/great-reset/

 

The brazil 1 per 100,00 flu mortality rate was mentioned because ours is significantly higher, 30 per 100,000.
The point being that covid is killing a hell of a lot of people in countries where the flu mortality rate is significantly lower than ours.

 

Its tricky, seems like various studies put the IFR (InfectionFatality Rate) at somewhere between 0.5% and 1%.
This is a really interesting article about it:
https://www.nature.com/articles/d41586-020-01738-2

Of course this makes it less fatal then the Flu - but its way more contagious, so the number of people it kills is much higher. And of course that IFR number varies massively depending on age - over 65s its around 5% IFR.
Also, getting it and surviving is no walk in the park for a significant minority and may well be life shortening for a great number of those. I'll take my chances with a vaccine thanks.

 

How so? I'm all for freedom to choose. I wear a mask when I go into a shop despite the science reagrding masks and their effectiveness being highly disputed (by our own government a few short months ago). I wear it because I have to. I'm saying I should have the right to not wear one in a shop. Do you honestly think this virus and the associated deaths (now down to 23,000) justifies the mandated mask wearing, the destruction of the economy and peoples' businesses and lives? We have had worse flu seasons with no lockdown, no masks, no social distancing so sorry if I seem irrational to you, but I smell a rat with this.

 

I can't be arsed to argue about the so-called "facts" and "figures" about the disease. To do that, I'd have to research it to know what I was talking about, and I can't be arsed to do that either. All I know is that life would be a lot better if the disease didn't exist. But since it undoubtedly does exist, life would be a lot better if there were a cure. But since there isn't a cure, life would be a lot better if there were a vaccine. That's why I've put myself forward to help vaccine research, if required. It's the least I can do for people less fortunate, health wise, than me.

 

There is nothing worse than grammar copper. Again, you have provided no counter argument or data, just a snide dig at my mispelling of ad hominem. Pathetic really. I thought us Yorkshire folk were made of sterner stuff. A real shame.

 

How many have actually died from Covid 19.

I dont mean those with comorbidites. Or 'suspected of' on the death certificate.

Its less than 3500 isnt it?

Alot of those 37k who are suspected/comorbities on the figures will be getting removed once the urgent review has been completed will be getting removed.

Best case for the inaccruacies is a few thousand. Id be going on that figure being halved.

So these comorbidites. Given the age demographic of a vast percentage of the deaths it would appear that its the weakend state that has left them vunerabale to infection.

Youve also got life style choices and issies around obesity. Carring extra weight puts extra strain on your bodies... meaning you cant fight infection.

Then you look at the spike in cases. Poor cramped housing. Regardless of ethnic origin.
Cramped housing equals a rapid viral spread.

Then look at how other countries have handled it.
The much mocked Belerus on here. Bad **** government. No lockdown. Business as usual.
Our Nordic neighbours who have more or less returned to normal.
Japan. The cities are very population dense. Handled better than us.

Spain. Massive lockdown. Masks everywhere. Spikes
Belgium Massive lockdown. Spikes albeit in densely populated urban areas.
France. Massive lockdown. Spikes.
New Mexico. Various lockdown measures. Masks. I dont think theyve peaked yet. Theres many others in the same boat.
Even Hong Kong and China who again wear masks due to the air polution. Spikes
A land down under... constant lockdowns. Constant spikes.

Perhaps rather than look at a vaccine as the way out of this mess (given the flu vaccine has taken 80 plus years to get tl where it is and still isnt 100% effective) we look at what we can do.

Perhaps rather than lock everything down tighter than a camels arse and wear a manky bit of cloth over your face as a placebo measure, we look at those countries that have fayered better and see what we can pinch to do the same.

The human body if fueled and maintained right is a fantastic thing especially the immune system. Perhaps we should trust it and let it do its thing rather than hiding away in fear. Let nature do its thing especially in thos weather and do what people did before Coronaphobia. Sheltered those who were at risk.

Currently the odds of catching Corona is miniscule.

As a bit of perspective more people committed suicide last year than will have died this year directly from Corona.

 

Ok I do genuinely apologise for my response bit i am pretty much at exasperation point. I survived covid after being really ill with it and having to have a significant period off work. I honestly thought I would not survive it on a couple of occasions. I also infected my wife who is only 2 years post chemo and was shielding. It's been a fairly horrific few months. I probably need to stop posting about this now because it's clearly too personal.

 

Some extremely dubious statistics bandied about there bit if that's what you believe then fair enough.

 

I'm chuffed for you that you are through the other side, and your wife also, it really must have been horrible. Thanks for the apology but there really is no need, I think we all need to take a step back and reflect on what really matters in all this. Turning on eachother seems to be the "done thing" these days. All the best to you and yours, and heres to a cracking season in the championship for the reds!

 

Its personal to you and so it should be from what you've shared. But please, do carry on posting. I respect the view of someone who has had it and seen it regularly much much more than people who try and downplay it as nothing that a stiff upper lip can get past and pretend hardly anyone has even died from it.

Its just the latest thing they can be contrarian about.

 

Made my day
UTR

 

Yes I'll just have a sit back for a while
And try to be more considered on return.
Cheers for that.

 

Research into excess deaths shows 60k deaths this year so far. What do you think might have caused them.

 

So, with lockdown we still had 60.000 ish deaths.

You are saying we shouldn't have bothered and have how many deaths?

How many infected is acceptable?

How many deaths is acceptable?

If one of those deaths was you or a close member of your family would that change your mind?

 

you have no facts to have reasonable debate with just barely understood terms you regurgitate

Hers some grown up data analysts looking at CV19.

 

https://www.independentsage.org/an-...cument-on-contact-tracing-and-self-isolation/

Some decent research behind this.

 

PHE for example.

 

There are countries that didn't lockdown and have had less deaths so that isn't a valid argument in my opinion.

Its a virus, there is bound to be lots of infections due to the nature of its transmission.

The acceptability of deaths question is a straw-man argument intended to make the answerer seem "unfeeling". Any death Covid or otherwise is tragic but the economic armaggeddon we have socially distanced ourselves into will claim more lives than Covid ever will in my opinion. The complete and utter destruction of our economy, this will cripple the opportunities for my kids and theirs. But I dare say we will see a new order emerge from all this, a cashless society (because cash is dirty apparently) social distancing to keep people fearful of oneanother, and mandatory vaccinations with E-certification to prove you have been vaccinated. Sounds brilliant doesn't it? Ordo Ab Chao