Thanks Keir

No, he said he’d support the government in the measures (quite sensible to say that really given the carnage that would be caused if they said they didn’t, even if he doesn’t agree with all of it, going against it is most certainly not in the interest of the country and moving forward), but still continued to criticise the government for its general response and on particulars.

No opposition is going to oppose everything the government says or does just for the sake of it.

No party is going to do everything you want them to and you won’t agree with everything. Think carefully on who to support or withdraw support from though - even in a hung parliament the pm would only ever be red or blue.

I know where my support is.

 

Just listened to the latest guess what to do conference and heard nothing of interest followed by no challenge at all.

 

Well it would be preferable to what we’ve got at the moment. What’s the point of having another Corbin style party when it’s just handing the Tories a free hit at the next election. Say what you like about the Blair government it was darn sight better than what we have now.

 

I think Starmer is doing a great job - an actual statesman, and somebody for a change who is competent. The difference between him and Boris is pretty clear to me.

Hopefully he gets a chance to show us what he's got over the next few years and the media don't find some way to smear him too much.

I think that once covid and brexit are cleared up we'll hopefully hear more of his personality and vision coming through.

 

What I find really odd is this:

whilst it would be a frustration, limiting households to meet would curb the spread of the virus, the science backs this up. It wouldn’t harm the economy a great deal and a carve out could be put in place re childcare.

so why not do it?

instead they put these measures in - I’m really not convinced sticking a mask on when going to a loo in a pub will make any difference at all? Whereas I can visit a pub and meet 5 mates who in turn could have met 24 mates the night before and so on....

As @Tyketical Masterstroke rightly points out above, it’s illogical nonsense and should be challenged.

it’s either:-

Ill thought out; or
Token and not designed to genuinely curb the spread.


I can’t work out which.

 

23 years goes back to 1997, doesn't it? What happened for the first 13 years of that period, and what has happened since?

 

Pretty much this.

I'm a huge leftie and Corbyn was the dream for me. Proper Labour.

However, whilst I find it tough to see this current 'new' Labour, I am trying to accept that to get in power, Labour must be seen as electable. Basically, con folk into voting for them by being seen as centrists, then move to the left once in power.

It's not for me, but I'd take that over this abomination leading the country right now.

Risky though, as I know a lot of folk who are similarly leftie Labour like myself who are of the same mind as Tyketical.

 

The country as a whole has become more Conservative. You just decide which version you prefer at the polling station.

 

Interesting choice of words.

The problem being opposing actions will literally kill people - and him opposing the actions, even if he doesn’t actually agree with them all, would be used as a political tool against him, a suggestion he’d sooner people die.

He’s damned if he does, damned if he doesnt. He can’t make the government change its approach, and opposing them actions is dangerous, to the country’s mortality and politically.

And supporting a government in a particular set of actions, even if you yourself don’t agree, doesn’t make him a Tory cheerleader. He certainly isn’t.

 

Bang on.

 

Very true. Right up to the 90s we had large scale trade union membership which ensured good backing for the Labour party.
Once manufacturing and heavy industry was decimated (thanks to Maggie) the trade union movement collapsed, along with traditional support that Labour could always previously count on.

 

I agree. I more than agree - Gaddaffi's governement was better than this one we have. I was merely guessing at the OP's viewpoint?

 

Yes understood

 

Just. Wow.

 

I’m not a fan of his but I’d vote for him because he’s better than the alternative.

I really wish he’d stick the boot in though.

If he gets near to an election & it’s looking close the propaganda will start & they’ll ensure he doesn’t win like they did with Milliband & Corbyn. He needs to capitalise now, no playing Mr nice guy with his ‘forensic’ questions.

 

So what would you have him do? Say that?

Alienate the people who didn’t vote for him, who he needs to vote for him next time, by telling them they were stupid, they were brainwashed and they were wrong?

No. As much as I agree with what you are saying (and to be honest I don’t doubt Keir thinks that himself really), he’s much better saying ‘yes, we weren’t elected, we’ve listened to you and here’s what we’re doing much better now’ - which in effect might be much the same but packaged better and more likely to be supported.

 

If he pushes back on this he gives Johnson an easy out when he attacks him on mixed messaging hes right to say these measures are required but lay the blame squarely at Johnson and Cos handling of the Covid outbreak for the need. Johnson is clearly out of his depth when facing Starmer but to be honest he was out of his depth when he faced Angela Rayner at the last PMQs and she's a Comprehensive educated ex care worker not a top lawyer maybe Stanley Johnson should ask Eton for his money back because Boris clearly didn't learn much in his time there. Starmer is playing the long game and playing it well imho

 

He's doing that quite well. He only wants to focus his attention on what will happen after 2024. He must have a good crystal ball.

 

Couldn't agree more. I don't agree with everything he does but there's no point in having great policies if you're never elected and able to implement them.

Until we have proportional representation I'll continue to vote for the most credible alternative to the ******* Tories. Why? Because it's the best we can hope for.

 

Which was the modus operandi of the iron b1tch.

Decimate industry and become a service lead economy. Kills the unions and creates mini capitalists who think they are part of the U.K. version of the American dream.

The biggest lie in and destruction of Britain as a super power on the World stage. Due to this it also mean Brexit has taken that to a while new level.

We don’t manufacture and export anything like we used to and rely heavily on import to survive. The great services and banks are all moving abroad because we’ve got nothing to offer.

A complete cluster fcukk of epic proportion.