Even more Brexit joy.

Let us “all” try to make things work he says from his retirement home in Italy..... nice touch after voting to end free movement which I personally used as my retirement lifestyle as it gave me relief from PTSD..... I’m alright jack.....

 

I agree. The solution would be in something like a 5% cap - you have to hit a certain threshold to actually gain representation - that would root out actual Nazi's as opposed to UKIP before they went loopy (and also whatever the leftist equivalent is considered to be).

I also think that that possibility would encourage joined up thinking from senior politicians in the main parties. They'd know they'd have to compromise more to avoid extremism.

That said, the Tories have bullied the Lib Dems and the DUP into doing whatever they liked under FPTP in the last decade, so it probably is quite dangerous.

I just keep thinking 'what if' about Clegg's AV referendum, another thing they got shafted on. If that had gone through, Labour would have won in 2015 or 2017, no doubt.

 

Lots of people voted in the general election based on this one issue, is beholden on us to be fully aware of any impacts, positive or negative. Look, I get it’s hard to be a Tory who voted remain, thanks to Farage who enticed enough of the racist end of the Tory party away, the leave headbangers took over your party in order to win them back. Along with presenting it as a vote against the establishment ( led by Reece Mogg - and other impeccable members of that establishment) they won over many disillusioned working class voters who never much cared for Europe thanks to 30 years of anti-Europe nationalistic tub-thumping from the Press ( largely owned by an Australian).
Now we have a government run by people not picked based on their competency at running the country but by their ideologically purity to this single issue. The likes of Prity Patel and Gavin Williamson and indeed the PM himself have previously been found unfit for high office, yet here we are. So, I get that the best thing to quieten your cognitive dissonance at having to defend these minnows of intellect and giants of incompetence is to ignore the fire that’s burning the house down, but in the long run it’s just going to get worse. You’d be better accepting the Tory party is no longer the Party of the Union (they don’t care about Scotland or Northern Ireland) nor the party of business - with the exception of a few outliers like that c@ck who owns Wetherspoons ( not a great advert for the cause) - Brexit has been widely slammed by business leaders large and small. Once you accept this you can either fight to get back the party you clearly feel invested in, or you can stop supporting them.

 

Eh?
His post - the post you quoted - is an explanation of why he believes we're fk*CED and your reply to that is 'why? Nobody ever explains'.

Jay: I don't like EastEnders, it's too glum and depressing for me The acting is over the top, the storylines are unrealistic and there's too much violence for me.
You: Why do you refuse to tell me why you don't like EastEnders?

 

I love the "let's just try to make things work" rhetoric from the Brexiteers. It's tragicomic on several levels. Firstly, the implicit acceptance that it is proving to be the inevitable **** up that anyone not blinded by lies, an over inflated sense of the country's importance, or xenophobia could see coming like a big red bus.

Also it implies that some people might not be trying to make it work for some unknown reason. As if business owners/employees in the middle of a pandemic and a looming recession are going to be actively sabotaging things just because they voted remain. So they can say "I told you so" when they are unemployed and destitute. Aye, alreyt.

Finally it sets up the future lie - that Brexit was only a failure because of the enemy within who didn't buy into it. Traitors wedded to Europe and socialism who were happy to see the country fail etc.

 

whether you like them or not, the 'odious right wingers' are entitled to stand for election, to deny PR on the basis that it would be possible to elect these people points to a dictatorship, more in line with nazi germany or a communist regime where peoples opinions are suppressed.

the rise of ukip was on the back of blatent lies by both the tories and the labour party, the labour party in particular promised a referendum during their 1997 election campaign, in fact as far back as micheal foot the party actually stood on a election campaign to get us out of europe

the roots of the 'odious' right wingers can be traced back to the lies and deciept perpetuated by our two major parties

we are constantly remined of the 'lies' during the referendum campaign but for some reason most people forget about the lies that were told long before 2016.

 

I’ve just given you some facts.
Prior to the Brexit vote you were given facts
During the Brexit negotiations all the facts were available

You chose to ignore facts and believe politicians who offered something you wanted to hear but was light on ‘facts’. Right wing politicians have always chosen to appeal to emotion rather than intellect.

And now you want to pretend the facts weren’t available to you. It’s not about being an idiot, but it definitely does point to a wilful ignorance.

 

I didn’t say whether there was a difference, just that they had in fact both lied....

 

You suggested it was an equivalence.
You know it was disingenuous, I expect a higher standard, I don’t know why, I’m constantly disappointed

 

Brilliant.... do you want me to call the nurse for you?

 

Pretty sure I'm not denying proportional representation.

 

Just to be clear I never voted for it and I NEVER set out to defend anybody let alone the government I only said that when ( after due democratic process) it happened and had to be made to work, it was never going to go smoothly from the start, not with so much intransigence on both sides and that was before Covid happened.
It will and has to get better though because businesses on both sides that are suffering will be pushing really hard to get it working.
How tjhe hell you get that I'm 'invested' in the Tories is beyond me. although clearly to some on here if you aren't left then you must be right, which is actually not true, some of us just look at what'[s happening and dare to have an opinion outside politics!
I fully intended keeping out of this argument but I refuse to let anybody say I'm doing something I'm not!

 

Why?

 

Testing programme, correct.

 

Only because not enough people are thinking about the long term future of the planet and the life on it. It's not at all pointless, the more people vote Green, the more the other parties have to take notice. Caroline Lucas has done a fantastic job raising awareness.

 

Well done mate. Just out of interest what would you like to see them called? Genuine question by the way.

 

Main problem about posting on here is that it remains in perpetuity, like it's been carved in stone. You make an off the cuff remark and it disappears into the ether of the pub often with a further explanation of what you meant, here it lasts forever without you expanding on it as you weren't questioned at the time and a week later you're having to explain a post you can't even remember making.

 

Oooooh, good one.

 

https://www.instituteforgovernment.org.uk/blog/covid-vaccine-decisions-brexit

 

I don't know to be honest - I just think that there's a stigma with the public when it comes to the current name.