Fantastic result in Batley and Spen

Had a quick look, and it looks like the Heavy Woollen District Independents were third in 2019. I assume this is the Party/policies that George Galloway has usurped.



If Labour are to become a force again in the North, they need to be increasing vote share not losing 7%.
Obviously Sir Keir has put a positive spin on it, but in real terms they're still losing ground.

 

his dad owned a factory that made tools. But not really the point. People dismiss Raynor as thick because she has a working class accent.

 

Nearly 4000

 

obviously this. Even on this thread those who support him don’t think he will win an election. In that case what’s the point in wasting the next 3 years.

 

Agreed. Also note the appalling turn out, less than 50%. Using crude maths in my head that works about 15% of registered voters went out and voted for Labour.

In somewhere like Batley? A victory in name only.

 

I think it's because they don't think Labour will win an election, not just Keir Starmer. Whoever is leading the party.
If Labour want to be a force again, they need to pick an identity and stick with it, and convert people to their way of thinking slowly. Bar something absolutely catastophic (and if mishandling a global pandemic isn't bad enough I don't know what is) Labour have sod all chance of increasing voter share to even stop the Conservatives having a majority.

 

HeavyWoollen District Independents- founded by former local UKIP leader? I think it’s safe to say they all voted Tory yesterday.

 

Just out of interest, who do you think would win an election for Labour, and why / how do you think they will do it?

 

First Labour by-election win since 2012 by the way….

 

I don't wish to get into a row with you or anyone else, North Yorks Red, but give a different perspective on the result and campaign. Batley and Spen will forever be associated with the murder of a young mum in broad daylight by a Right Wing Terrorist. No investigation into who organised the assassination, who gave the order. The narrative put in the press was that he was a person working in isolation. He wasn't, he had a long history of association with Right Wing groups at home and abroad.
One would have hoped that such an act would have changed UK society for the better, I imagine we both agree that doesn't seem to be the case,sadly.
In Yorkshire, there are many extremist groups, on all sides but certainly Far Right ,Neo Nazi. There are also Far Right groups with similar beliefs, who are already elected at local level. These run under the Patriotic, Nationalist,Royalist banners.
In Batley during this campaign and in other election campaigns over the past few years, there has been violence and intimidation of political candidates. You will agree, this is not the British way,the lack of leadership from Prime Minister's, is well unspeakable.
The fact that the sister of a murdered MP was physically threatened and intimidated in person, let alone indirectly, shows how far this country has fallen. The threat to politicians of all parties is real and a lot of work is done to protect them and their families. It is not just politicians but their staff as well.
The Press, present a world in the UK of a functioning democracy, it isn't.
Why George Galloway is allowed to stand in UK politics, I don't understand. He is a professional agitator,a media construct. He is also very dangerous to democracy, creating chaos,division,violence, just like Farage,Robinson, Fox et al. Why would supposed patriots,socialists,muslims, follow or believe a man,who in the midst of the Gulf war, saluted those who killed allied forces?
It was predicted, even in the Labour Party, that they would lose. For some reason, the UK wants or seems to want to blame the Labour party for everything that's wrong in the UK. I'm not a member or supporter of any party.
The UK population appears at times to be suffering a form of Stockholm syndrome, where they can see what the problems are,who is responsible, and what solutions there are. Then,they do nothing and carry on, whether it's because they realise it would lead to massive change and upheaval, fear of the unknown? I don't know.
I wish anyone who decides to become a politician, at whatever level and for whichever party,safety and peace for them and their families and staff. I reserve the right to disagree with them,though.

 

Can I ask why you would vote for a Labour party that is headed up by someone who's political views are not aligned with yours(assuming the who party and the election campaign is also built around said leader's views)?

Not having a pop or trying to trip you up/cause an argument, by the way. I'm just very interested in why people vote for who they do...

 

Argument?I thought I was agreeing with you, that’s what I kind of meant albeit in a shorter format

 

I agree re the working class, but how is Kier more Islington dinner party than JC?

And I think you missed my point, I don’t think Labour can hope to attract most of the self employed brickies who are living the Thatcherite dream, or warehouse workers who voted to leave the EU because their kids schools are full of foreigners.

That ship has sailed.

My frustration and we see it on here, are the shy Tories, who have a vague dislike of the fact they vote Tory, and the only justification they’ll offer out loud is ‘but Labour’. Because they know their reason for voting Tory is tenuous, and rather than admitting they’re possibly doing themselves and the country a disservice, they’ll blame anyone and anything else.

The last Labour government gets attacked from every single direction. But the truth is, if we listed every single error they made in 15 years in power, it wouldn’t be worse than any given month of Johnson’s government.

Just like suggesting working class people won’t vote for KS because he’s a bit ‘Islington dinner party’, yet somehow they can vote for a Bullingdon club buffoon? It’s literally mental.

We can’t line up with a bright working class kid who did good, but we can associate ourselves with a bunch of toffs who we know have no interest in our life at all.

 

They shouldn't be giving up on any section of society if they have a desire to get back in power. The people I know who are part of the old working-class who are doing very well don't warm to Starmer. They see him as London centric/liberal elite. As for voting for Boris, not perhaps so mystifying, I think he rode three waves. One was honouring the brexit result. The second, a bit lesser was that a lot of people in the North had felt neglected (including 13 years of labour) and the Tories suddenly started speaking to them, the third was JC was portrayed as unelectable in the media. Personally I think bojo will become a liability and won't fight the next election but labour needs someone who connects with the regions outside the M25

 

That isn’t correct I don’t think. Labour won Oldham in the early days of Corbyn (I think 2016?).

Big upset it was. The right wing media threw everything at it as part of the witch hunt. The beeb even had an all night “by-election” special to celebrate his demise. Andrew Neil’s face when the socialist, Labour candidate won is one of my favourite telly moments!

 

Labour aren’t the same party we grew up with. To win people need to make a choice. Back this version of Labour or see us lose. A different leader isn’t going to change anything the press, tories or social media do. A different leader isn’t going to suddenly sweep the nation like a pied piper ala Blair. If one did the only way to do this is to pitch yourself in the centre like Blair did, and as far as I can work out no one in Labour actually wants that.

The country has changed, the nationalistic nature of the country and it’s current leaders saddens me, to fight it though we need to back our party, vote tactically maybe... as the options aren’t even worth considering.

 

I think Burnham would have a better chance of winning. His politics aren’t mine but he could match Bojos populist agenda. He would be a figure who could unite Labour as Starmer promised to do but has more personality to do so.

The one I would see as being able to challenge not only the tories but the hegemony within Labour is Clive Lewis. He is in favour of a Progressive Alliance and PR both of which I see as the only way to remove the tories without Scotland which won’t come back to Labour. Again he’s softer left than me but could be persuaded back for a party led by him. Think the ex soldier angle would play well to the social conservatives.

Parties and politicians are unlikely to align directly with any individual. At the minute the closest to my views and the ones I will vote for are the Greens but I’m the archetypal floating voter so could easily be won back by a Labour Party actually offering Opposition and a vision of the future

 

Labour won 9 by elections from 15-19.

 

That ‘bit of a gobshite’ you refer to has done a fantastic job as Mayor of Manchester. When asked on QT last night about the direction of British politics, he mentioned what is//has happened in Manchester and Liverpool is that the whole Communities are working together, cross- party, rich/ poor, ethnicity and are making positive changes from the bottom up. He suggested that this was the way to go. I noticed when he was being attacked by the Tories and their controlled press and media, the locals from all parties stood with him. By the way he spoke up about your darling Keir Starmer as well. I’ll take Andy Burnham-type people any day than any of the Tory ***** and some Labour ones as well.

 

There we go! I thought there was a few but didn’t want to trip myself up! Probably being airbrushed from history because Corbyn........