Starmer intends to stand down...

I'm not assuming he's guilty at all. I'm looking at it from a non Labour supporter pov. I think this muddying of the waters isn't necessarily helpful.

 

You said "He must have known that he'd broken the law" and "a smart move would be not to have broken any lockdown rules" so I'm sure you'll understand why it appears you are assuming he's guilty.

 

Fair enough. I still think he could be being too clever for his own good but time will tell.

 

One thing I will say is that if I had a job that required me to neglect my family and life to the extent that I needed to continue working beyond 10pm on an evening, then I would be seriously considering resignation.

 

It is just a blatant hatchet job, to get rid of him, and it will probably work. The video that’s been released shows people fairly spread out, it’s doubtful that anybody turned up specifically for the curry, but there’ll be some technicality that means a fine will be issued that wouldn’t have been possible if a few people had sent a few emails afterwards.

Compare that with the absolute disregard for the rules and why they were in place that was shown in Downing St and it paints a pretty grim picture.

Countries must look at the reporting of this, compared to the reporting of the Johnson breaches, along with their neglect in dealing with cost of living crisis, various extreme policies (vote suppression, criminalising protests, Rwanda etc) and the imminent collapse of the UK, and probably see us in a similar light to the likes of Russia and North Korea.

 

Keir has very clearly stated "I haven't broken the law". I believe he will be proved correct.

One thing though. I would not have said "I will resign if I get a FPN." If a FPN is not paid, the Police have to decide whether they will then pursue a conviction through the magistrates' court. I would have been saying that if I am issued with a FPN I will dispute it. If a prosecution is brought, I will defend that. If I am convicted after all my avenues of appeal are exhausted, I will then resign. That might mean standing aside while the legal process is exhausted, but as a matter of principle I would have taken that stance if I were Keir. The Police can not be trusted to get the law right, as they proved in the case of Mary Dinou, who was wrongfully arrested at Newcastle Central Railway Station and then detained. I would not have made my leadership a hostage to their judgement.

Just in case though, you can still get 40/1 for Major Dan to be next Labour Leader!

 

Johnson said he thought it was a business meeting but his wife was there. The difference is he is a compulsive liar with zero morals.

 

Like any one gives a **** about principles anymore. Bojo shouldn’t be in office still now anyway.

 

This @Redhelen
No matter how many denials, the Tory press wouldn’t let up, and ‘someone’ put a lot of pressure on the Durham police to reopen an investigation (bear in mind they’d already concluded an investigation and decided the law wasn’t broken.

It wasn’t just going to go away. Starmer had no choice but to front it out.

 

Looks like Labour can supply evidence that they returned to work after the meal in the form of emails etc. Tremendous waste of time drummed up by the far right press. We should send the cost of the investigation into the Scum and Daily Heil.

 

If I were labour or basically any candidate at the next general election my entire campaign would be based around a promise to push for changes in Westminster.

If I get elected I promise to use my position to campaign for a change so that any serving minister who is convicted of a crime or fined by police is guilty of gross misconduct and can be fired for it. It's how you would expect to be treated at work and it's how you should expect us to be treated at work.
If I get elected I promise to use my position to campaign for a change so that drinking alcohol whilst at work as a serving minister is gross misconduct and we can be fired for it. It's how you would expect to be treated at work and it's how you should expect us to be treated at work.
If I get elected I promise to use my position to campaign for a removal of the heavily subsidised restaurant in Westminster and to have it replaced with a meal allowance identical to the budget we set for school meals. We expect your growing children to live off this food and if it's good enough for them it should be good enough for us.
If I get elected I promise to use my position to campaign that lying in parliament should be a disciplinary matter. If you lied at work you would expect to be disciplined and if we do then you should expect that we too will be disciplined.

If I get elected I promise to use my position to ensure wherever possible that politicians are treated the same as you, the electorate.

I'd walk it

 

You may get elected running on that manifesto, but there is absolutely no way that any of that would get through the Commons. The MPs with their noses in the troughs will never support losing their pay days

 

Oh believe me I know that but it would force them all to publicly reveal themselves.

 

You wouldn't, because your own party would stab you in the back.

 

You could just bring in PR and US style mandatory reselection and that would get rid of a lot of the issues. The idea that being a politician is a job for life needs to end. I’d also pay no more than 2 x the average wage. All research /admin staff to come from a central pool paid for by the state. Buy a hotel in central London and let MPs stay there when parliament is sitting and stop any expenses other than basic stuff that anyone working can claim. Soon remove those who just want to bleed is dry.

 

I was reading a bit about the initial footage and it’s source.

It turns out the son of the founder of the uber far right Breitbart just happened to be outside the window and just happened to decide to film the far from incriminating footage. So perturbed from this casual stumbling upon non flagrant rule breaking he then shared it with the far right oddity Laurence Fox. He then tweeted the footage about 9-10 months ago.

And only recently have the Tory supporting media gone to town on it…. Can’t imagine the reasoning why.

The media reaction to each phase of this has been utterly ridiculous. And also unsurprising to see the fickle left leaning Owen Jones using it to put the boot in.

 

And that is exactly what he’s saying he did.

Remember Durham police have already concluded no rules were broken once - and I suspect they’ll make the same findings again.

 

People like Jones will help ensure the Tories are in power for another 12 years.

 

He said - very clearly - he did not break any laws in the same speech. He was just making clear his position.

Starmer can be criticised for many things but not on his position here in my view. He’s done exactly what I’d expect.

 

I was never a fan of his opinions anyway, they just felt light and of the moment rather than from those formed from conviction and belief. But then he did his major pivot on his stance of Corbyn, which was just bizarre. The journalists have very good access to politicians and those who surround them. So to massively change a view of one when little has changed during their tenure is just bizarre.

I've much more time for someone like George Monbiot and Polly Toynbee. But I suppose Owen Jones is trying to occupy any niche which makes him feel relevant and pays his way in life, irrespective of how much he flip flops and contradicts his previous writings.