This!

The key here is surely the new manager. He has a very impressive profile. Retired from playing for medical reasons at age 19, he took a First Class degree in Sports Science at Loughborough. Since then he has coached at home and abroad, culminating in roles as Assistant to Brendan Rodgers and latterly, Ange Postocoglu. Add that in to the targeted hefty spending and Birmingham have surely given themselves the best possible chance of an immediate return to the Championship. The owners' ambitions clearly extend beyond that.

 

This thread has made me realise what a set of absolute ******* ******* support Barnsley. Stuck in the 1990s. World’s changed my dudes, football has changed.
People will say ‘oh every club has them’. I honestly can say, hand on heart, Barnsley supporters have the most negative, I hate everything the club do attitude. More so than any other team I have ever seen. Full of massive ******* bedwetters.

 

It's fair to say that some supporters are not entirely enamoured.

 

And a massive incentive to beat them!

 

Read it again. I'm saying it changed during his tenure, that it had been delivered up intil then. You asked the question, what was my expectation when i started watching the Reds. I had my first season ticket in 1986, at the age of 7. I never had to witness the ignominy of 3rd tier football for 15 years. So yes, my expectation was 2nd tier survival as an abolute non-negotiable minimum.

It's a remarkable downgrading of fans expectations - and like it or not, this stems from Cryne's time in charge, which is what i was referencing in my original post - that the club with the most years in the English second tier (and it isn't even close) somehow think that they have no right in the natural order if things to now be in the second tier. It's an unjustified inferiority complex but it certainly suits the owners and allows them to serve up football below the level the fanbase should be demanding year after year.

 

And we've been left 30 years behind (a bit like your language, 'dude' - are you a teenage turtle?) with a crumbling stadium and playing the likes of Mansfield, Burton Albion and Cambridge year after year.

Call that bedwetting if you like.

 

Yes, because the owners, who fans constantly remind us are purely here to make money, are content losing around 10 million every couple of seasons, just so they don't have to serve us up some decent football.

Come on mate...

 

Where did i say they don't have good intentions mate? I don't think they're bad people, very far from it. I think they are likeable and have the clubs best interest at heart.

They're just not very good at this though, are they? We're suffering an unsuccessful period on the pitch when you assess it historically (which is the only baselibe I can think to use) and they're losing a fuuck ton of money. I can't imagine anyone is happy with it.

 

Apologies then bud, I must have read your post wrong- I think a big problem is this current board have started in a losing position due to their association with Conway and Lee- they almost got it spot on the first season with Duff but sadly went backwards last season with the fans, despite still finishing in play offs. I do think this season could be defining for them

 

I think the main concern for me is the feeling that every year is a massive rebuild. They seem unable to build continuity and stability and it feels like Groundhog Day

- More than half last year's starting XI gone (and that's before we've done the almost inevitable selling a couple to help balance the books)
- A new manager having to find his way and establish himself
- No business other than free agency concluded in a timely fashion despite the manager publically stating on several occasions that he was extremely keen to get that sorted early

How confident are we that we won't be in exactly the same position in late July 2025?

 

We have a league 1 budget and a championship budget.

Neither will probably big enough but they are factured in to our commercial plan to keep the business running.

As we know not every team can be promoted so it's either spend money we don't have or trust in the coaches and team and that we get a bit of luck and are successful.

If we have money and the Directors are not putting it in to the club and are pocketing it then we do have a problem.

The only way i think owners can make money is by selling the club for a profit.

 

I don’t accept that you had any expectations at 7 yrs old, and that was kind of my point. We start with a clean slate, then move on to nothing being good enough.

Do you think we have better times because the fans ‘demand’ it and poor seasons because we ‘accept’ if?

 

No. Just having a conversation about the baseline by which we judge the current ownership. I'd argue they're currently underperforming versus a reasonable expectation, that's all.

 

From the outside looking in , 3 playoff campaigns in 4 seasons probably resembles a club on the front foot.

When we were smashing teams during the Clarke and Hunter era, I can’t remember anyone downplaying it because it was only lower league football and we’d been better in the 50s.

The football league, and below is littered with clubs that have fallen from grace, I expect they all have fans that argue the toss about where they should be. Some have even been where they shouldn’t, or couldn’t be without spending loads of money.

I think it’s fine for people to have expectations, realistic or otherwise. But it’s also fine for people not to, and to question others reasoning without being accused of ‘being up the owners arsenal’ - not by you btw.

My expectation is top 6 again

 

If you think the phrase ‘my dudes’ is outdated I think you may be the problem here.

 

When boiled down, the truths about investment and ambition are we missed our best opportunity over 40 years ago after we came up from the old 3rd division. Oakwell could accommodate 30k plus, we had a very good team and support and could easily have gone to the top flight when football was more of a level playing field. That really was our time, although the miners strike came a few years later.

There really was an advantage to be had back then, as Oxford proved under Maxwell, however short lived, whereas the football league is awash with ‘ambitious’ clubs of all sizes these days.

It’s a tough environment. I’d say unforgiving, but some clubs are allowed to do it time and again sadly, and that’s why some see it as the norm.

 

I like to call people ‘cats’. It prob dates back to hippies or even beatniks.