A question for those clamouring for Prem/Champ quality players..

Luke Steele
David Button
Bobby Hassell
Jay Maccavelli
Stephen Foster
Rob Edwards
Nathan Doyle
Michael Tonge
Korey Smith
David Cotterill
Andy Gray
Frank Nouble
Jacob Butterfield
*all of the above are contracted to us in some form or another
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Miles Addison
Cameron Park
Danny Drinkwater
Nile Ranger
Danny Haynes
Ricardo Vaz Te
*all the above were here in some form or another this season
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The first question - are/were these Prem/Champ quality players? They have all spent the majority of their careers in one or both of those divisions, so that IMO makes them experienced at those levels.
There are 19 players in total there, so where has this myth (IMO) come from that we have no quality players for this level, and that we have a squad full of lower leaguers who are not good enough for this division?
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From that 19, I can only put forward 5, maybe 6 that I would say have done okay or better when playing this season.
Butterfield
Steele
Vaz Te
Drinkwater
Hassell
Gray
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You could even argue that Gray and Hassell have had poor to average campaigns, depending upon your opinion on them. So that leaves 4 of our 'Prem/Champ' players this season (from 19) that we would all agree have had great seasons. And as we know, only 2 of those remain, and 1 of them is definitely leaving soon, leaving just our keeper and POTY, who will have his admirers this summer.
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So, why are people so keen to see Keith and co recruit more of these types of player? Our/his success rate is quite poor when recruiting players of that ilk. Answers on a postcard as to why that is...
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Scott Wiseman
Jimmy McNulty
Lee Collins
Scott Golbourne
Jim O'Brien
Matty Done
David Perkins
Stephen Dawson
Paul Digby
Reuben Noble-Lazarus
Chris Dagnall
Craig Davies
Kallum Higginbotham
Danny Rose
*all the above are players contracted to us in one way or another
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This list of 14 players contains those who I would term lower league, or inexperienced at this level. Yes, O'Brien, Dagnall, Davies and McNulty have had a season (roughly) at this level before, but they are hardly hardened pro's in the division.
Of that 14, Id say that 5 of them have had decent or better, campaigns. Davies, McNulty, O'Brien, Perkins and Done. I also think that Collins, Dawson, RNL, Rose and Digby have looked decent at times, in their limited appearances.
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So, for me at least, our inexperienced players have had a better impact, on a cheaper level. The success rate from that bunch is far better than the 19 'proven' players... and, if I want to get fussy, I could argue that Drinkwater, Butterfield AND Vaz Te were actually inexperienced at this level. Certainly, in comparison to the likes of Doyle, Maccavelli and Cotterill.
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So my key question I suppose is - what are Prem/Champ quality players? And why all of a sudden is Keith even suggesting we need some?
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IMO, we need 'quality' players, period. What division they play in is irrelevant...
Thoughts??

 

Excellent post mate!

 

I fully agree with this Whitey. Excellent post.

I'd suggest that Keith has recognised the need for SOME experienced heads, but he also needs to keep finding rough diamonds. It wouldn't surprise me to see Matt Done, Scott Wiseman, Scott Golbourne and Jim McNulty have excellent seasons next year. They now know what to expect and how they have to play in the Championship. A full pre-season with a few more experienced players will do them a world of good.

 

Good post however I wouldn't trust Keith Hill to buy me a quality banana in a banana shop. He would find me a half price banana that once looked like it might grow into a good banana only to start turning brown and now finds itself discarded to the 'everything must go' banana shop around the corner.

 

From reading what’s been put Whtey we haven't had many experienced players on the pitch at the same time.
When the things are going good then the players from the lower league will be good, they had come from mostly teams that had won a lot last season and a lot of confidence. Didn't Rochdale finish 8th, Perkins won the POTY, PPOTY and Colchester finish around 12?

When the confidence bubble was *****ed and it was in a big way these players didn't know how to grind out wins.
Cotterill, Tonge Just haven't been fit enough, Smith isn't the most experienced and really only knows success before moving on loan and Buttons not played that many game at this level.
IF we could have got, Steele, Foster edwards, Tonge, gray through that centre then we could have built round them.
Another problem for me, LEADERS, we haven’t got any. From what I’ve seen PAUL DIGBYs more of a leader than 25/26/27 year old. Against Birmingham at 2-1 heads went, but not the 17 year old centre midfielder. It's not that they don't care but it's not natural to most.

IMO, we need 'quality' players, period. What division they play in is irrelevant... Agree whitey

Agree or don't agree, it's just my opinion

 

I agree, but, quality comes with a price. there are decent players around with Prem experience, but if they cant get into a lower prem team why would we want them? they just want a wage (see Diouf at pikeys)
Yes we need quality but we cant afford prem wages and that my friends is a fact!!
if I was the owner i wouldnt pump loads of cash in at the moment cos the crowds cannot support the wage bill.

 

While we have a lot of championship players, we don't have much championship quality and that's what Hill said he's after this summer.

 

But isn't that the point of Whitey's post, why do quality players have to have premiership, or even championship experience.

Take Dawson for example, not seen much of him, but early glimpses shows he'll be a teriffic leader, he likes to get forward with the ball, and in the 2nd half at Hull, showed he can make things happen and change a game. He's got no experience at this or any higher level, yet he cost us next to nothing compared to what, say, Michael Tonge might cost us.

There are many players in the 3rd and 4th tier with the potential to make the step up, and with the minoscule budget we have, we ought to be taking a few gambles.

 

We have taken a few gambles. Have you not seen the amount of players we've brought in this season? It's time now to bring in some proven championship quality for the lower league inexperienced players to learn from.

 

Agree.

What is equally concerning is that the manager didn't know how to deal with the losing streak either. He began chopping and changing the line-up - when in reality he needed to stick with a settled team and get them properly organised from back to front.

 

Spot On. He kept saying we are looking at "permutations" but all this was was what you said. i know sometimes we could not have a settled side due to injury but we should have varied the style at the very least.

 

re archey......i think whoever we get archy they will be a gamble,same as everyone they've got since last summer has been a gamble...its up to the manager to show his ability (and the scouts) in finding players and getting them to perform,i'm sure more or less all the players hill has brought in were perfoming at their previous clubs,otherwise he wouldnt have got them,surely?,so why arnt they performing at this level,yes there have been isolated bits where they've done ok,but otherwise they've been poor,the ball is in hills court to get this lot competeing at this level.any new recruits he brings in,no matter where they are from must perform,otherwise keefy will be out of a job.