Islam is evil, terrorism is its logical consequence

After the terrorist attacks of September 11, President Bush declared: "These acts of violence against innocents violate the fundamental tenets of the Islamic faith."

But the Muslim murderer of Dutch filmmaker Theo van Gogh knows better than our president, and recently explained in court: "I acted purely in the name of my religion." So did the September 11 highjackers and the terrorists that bombed Madrid and London.

Consider the Koran, for example, which Muslims believe is the word of Allah revealed to Muhammad, his prophet. There is no shortage of passages in the Koran that, taken literally, demand just that kind of savagery (e.g., "And slay them wherever you catch them . . . and fight with them until there is no persecution, and religion should be only for Allah.").

In fact, no fewer than 36 different verses sprinkled throughout the Koran call on Muslims to wage war against non-Muslims (e.g., "Fight and slay the Pagans wherever you find them, and seize them, beleaguer them, and lie in wait for them in every stratagem of war.").

It is easy to see how Muslim fanatics who believe that these verses are the literal truth feel justified in their evil actions. They hear in these verses the demanding voice of Allah calling on them to act. And they seem willing to oblige.

If we want to understand the enemy and win this war, we must take these terrorists at their word and stop pretending that, in President Bush's characterization, "Islam is peace."

The truth is that "Islam" does not mean peace, as President Bush and many others would like to believe. Literally and existentially, "Islam" means surrender. Surrender to Allah--by the word or by the sword.

David Holcberg
Ayn Rand Institute

 

I had a taxi driver rattling on to me last weekend about how peaceful Islam is. He was completely oblivious to all the passages in the Koran describing what will be done to anyone not surrendering to Islam. Swore blind they weren't there.

In the end I told him to shut the **** up and go and read the book before attempting to preach its fascist nonsense to paying passengers.

**** tried to overcharge me as well.

 

Firstly Id seriously question any post that quotes anything that comes out of the Ayn Rand institute. Its ignored by virtually anyone of any philosophical or literary note.

Secondly,

That's not true. Firstly we dont know for certain why the bombers attacked London, although a website claimed after the bombing that it was due to Iraq. The failed bomber caught in Italy said under questioning that Iraq was his prime motivation and not his religion.

I always find it hilarious that many chose to blame Islam for these acts whilst ignoring the fact Mr Bush is a supposed Christian. I dont see Christianity being the focul point of blame for Iraq. I wonder why?

Anyone can use religion to justify their actions, George Bush has done this himself...

The very fact that the billions of Muslims in the world dont go blowing people up should tell you something about them and their beliefs, rather than simply blaiming an entire religion for the wrong doings of a few nummb skulls.

The demonisation of individuals based on words they might or might not adhere to in ancient scripture is pointless and dangerous and adds nothing to solving the problems we all face.

 

And the bible says an eye for an eye, a tooth for a tooth - but Christians don't.

 

I've spent lots of time on many right wing, so called 'Christian' message boards and Ill tell you for a fact that many of them do. Some even think that as Christians they should destroy other religions and leave Christianity to 'rule in peace'.

 

pagans refer to those who worship more than one god and pagans

by your logic all christians are:
sexist - as the bible promotes subjugation of women
homophobic - as the bible promotes anti-homosexuality

what a total ***** post you've just made. what is the number of murders committed by every muslim? by your logic every muslim is a murderer.

 

i hope you're embarrassed by that post

 

don't tell the bigots that

they might change their mindff
george w bush certainly thinks he's doing the lords work by butchering afghans and iraqis

 

RE: don't tell the bigots that

Too right he does. Since he overcame his drinking problem he turned to 'Christianity' and God, who he believes helped him overcome his problems. He and many other US 'Christians' believe that he is God's representitive here on earth.

Frankly he should have done us all a favour and carried on drinking.

 

RE: pagans refer to those who worship more than one god and pagans

It's no use, he only has a one sided coin.

 

Go on then.

Let's hear it.

 

RE: Annoyingly I find myself in full agreement with Acky on this

Ill take the back handed compliment!

(blaze)

 

A few snippets.

Torment to Non-believers:
4.56: (As for) those who disbelieve in Our communications, We shall make them enter fire; so oft as their skins are thoroughly burned, We will change them for other skins, that they may taste the chastisement; surely Allah is Mighty, Wise.


Islam Acceptable:
3.85: And whoever desires a religion other than Islam, it shall not be accepted from him, and in the hereafter he shall be one of the losers.

No friends from outsiders
3.118: O you who believe! do not take for intimate friends from among others than your own people; they do not fall short of inflicting loss upon you; they love what distresses you; vehement hatred has already appeared from out of their mouths, and what their breasts conceal is greater still; indeed, We have made the communications clear to you, if you will understand.

Friends with Jews, Christians
5.51: O you who believe! do not take the Jews and the Christians for friends; they are friends of each other; and whoever amongst you takes them for a friend, then surely he is one of them; surely Allah does not guide the unjust people.

No friends with non believers
4.144: O you who believe! do not take the unbelievers for friends rather than the believers; do you desire that you should give to Allah a manifest proof against yourselves?

No friends with non believers
3.28: Let not the believers take the unbelievers for friends rather than believers; and whoever does this, he shall have nothing of (the guardianship of) Allah, but you should guard yourselves against them, guarding carefully; and Allah makes you cautious of (retribution from) Himself; and to Allah is the eventual coming.

No friends with parents/siblings if not believers
9.23: O you who believe! do not take your fathers and your brothers for guardians if they love unbelief more than belief; and whoever of you takes them for a guardian, these it is that are the unjust.

Fight non-believers
9.123: O you who believe! fight those of the unbelievers who are near to you and let them find in you hardness; and know that Allah is with those who guard (against evil).

Kill non-believers
4.89 : They desire that you should disbelieve as they have disbelieved, so that you might be (all) alike; therefore take not from among them friends until they fly (their homes) in Allah's way; but if they turn back, then seize them and kill them wherever you find them, and take not from among them a friend or a helper.

Anti Jewish verses
5.82: Certainly you will find the most violent of people in enmity for those who believe (to be) the Jews and those who are polytheists, and you will certainly find the nearest in friendship to those who believe (to be) those who say: We are Christians; this is because there are priests and monks among them and because they do not behave proudly.

God a plotter
8.30: And when those who disbelieved devised plans against you that they might confine you or slay you or drive you away; and they devised plans and Allah too had arranged a plan; and Allah is the best of planners.

Killing Idolaters
9.5: So when the sacred months have passed away, then slay the idolaters wherever you find them, and take them captives and besiege them and lie in wait for them in every ambush, then if they repent and keep up prayer and pay the poor-rate, leave their way free to them; surely Allah is Forgiving, Merciful.

Idolaters are unclean just because they are idolater
9.28: O you who believe! the idolaters are nothing but unclean, so they shall not approach the Sacred Mosque after this year; and if you fear poverty then Allah will enrich you out of His grace if He please; surely Allah is Knowing Wise.

Forcing non-believers to pay tax
9.29: Fight those who do not believe in Allah, nor in the latter day, nor do they prohibit what Allah and His Apostle have prohibited, nor follow the religion of truth, out of those who have been given the Book, until they pay the tax in acknowledgment of superiority and they are in a state of subjection.

The Torment of Hell
44.43: Surely the tree of the Zaqqum,

44.44: Is the food of the sinful

44.45: Like dregs of oil; it shall boil in (their) bellies,

44.46: Like the boiling of hot water.

44.47: Seize him, then drag him down into the middle of the hell;

44.48: Then pour above his head of the torment of the boiling water:

44.49: Taste; you forsooth are the mighty, the honorable:

44.50: Surely this is what you disputed about.

44.51: Surely those who guard (against evil) are in a secure place,

44.52: In gardens and springs;

44.53: They shall wear of fine and thick silk, (sitting) face to face;

44.54: Thus (shall it be), and We will wed them with Houris pure, beautiful ones.

44.55: They shall call therein for every fruit in security;

44.56: They shall not taste therein death except the first death, and He will save them from the punishment of the hell,

44.57: A grace from your Lord; this is the great achievement.

44.58: So have We made it easy in your tongue that they may be mindful.

All except Muslims/Jews/Christians/Sabeans will go to hell
2.62: Surely those who believe, and those who are Jews, and the f Christians, and the Sabians, whoever believes in Allah and the Last day and does good, they shall have their reward from their Lord, and there is no fear for them, nor shall they grieve.

All except Muslims/Jews/Christians/Sabeans will go to hell
5.69: Surely those who believe and those who are Jews and the Sabians and the Christians whoever believes in Allah and the last day and does good -- they shall have no fear nor shall they grieve.

Smite the neck and cut fingertips of unbelievers
8.12: When your Lord revealed to the angels: I am with you, therefore make firm those who believe. I will cast terror into the hearts of those who disbelieve. Therefore strike off their heads and strike off every fingertip of them.

Smite the neck of unbelievers
47.4: So when you meet in battle those who disbelieve, then smite the necks until when you have overcome them, then make (them) prisoners, and afterwards either set them free as a favor or let them ransom (themselves) until the war terminates. That (shall be so); and if Allah had pleased He would certainly have exacted what is due from them, but that He may try some of you by means of others; and (as for) those who are slain in the way of Allah, He will by no means allow their deeds to perish.





The Holy Qur'an: Text,
Translation & Commentary

Abdullah Yusuf Ali (Editor)

Severe Punishment for atheists
10.4: To Him is your return, of all (of you); the promise of Allah (made) in truth; surely He begins the creation in the first instance, then He reproduces it, that He may with justice recompense those who believe and do good; and (as for) those who disbelieve, they shall have a drink of hot water and painful punishment because they disbelieved.

5.10: And (as for) those who disbelieve and reject our communications, these are the companions of the name.

5.86: And (as for) those who disbelieve and reject Our communications, these are the companions of the flame.

Severe Punishment for non-believers
22.19: These are two adversaries who dispute about their Lord; then (as to) those who disbelieve, for them are cut out garments of fire, boiling water shall be poured over their heads.

22.20: With it shall be melted what is in their bellies and (their) skins as well.

22.21: And for them are whips of iron.

22.22: Whenever they will desire to go forth from it, from grief, they shall be turned back into it, and taste the chastisement of burning.



Severe Punishment for non-believers
72.23 : (It is) only a delivering (of communications) from Allah and His messages; and whoever disobeys Allah and His Apostle surely he shall have the fire of hell to abide therein for a long time.

98.6 : Surely those who disbelieve from among the followers of the Book and the polytheists shall be in the fire of hell, abiding therein; they are the worst of men.

Punishing non-believers of Hereafter
17.10 : And that (as for) those who do not believe in the hereafter, We have prepared for them a painful chastisement.

Punishing for rejecting faith
3.91 : Surely, those who disbelieve and die while they are unbelievers, the earth full of gold shall not be accepted from one of them, though he should offer to ransom himself with it, these it is who shall have a painful chastisement, and they shall have no helpers.

Unbelievers go to hell
4.140 : And indeed He has revealed to you in the Book that when you hear Allah's communications disbelieved in and mocked at do not sit with them until they enter into some other discourse; surely then you would be like them; surely Allah will gather together the hypocrites and the unbelievers all in hell.

7.36 : And (as for) those who reject Our communications and turn away from them haughtily -- these are the inmates of the fire they shall abide in it.

Partial Believers go to hell too
4.150 : Surely those who disbelieve in Allah and His apostles and (those who) desire to make a distinction between Allah and His apostles and say: We believe in some and disbelieve in others, and desire to take a course between (this and) that.

4.151 : These it is that are truly unbelievers, and We have prepared for the unbelievers a disgraceful chastisement.

4.152 : And those who believe in Allah and His apostles and do not make a distinction between any of them -- Allah will grant them their rewards; and Allah is Forgiving, Merciful.

Sadistic punishments
56.41 : And those of the left hand, how wretched are those of the left hand!

56.42 : In hot wind and boiling water,

56.43 : And the shade of black smoke,

56.44 : Neither cool nor honorable.

Punishment for apostates
16.106 : He who disbelieves in Allah after his having believed, not he who is compelled while his heart is at rest on account of faith, but he who opens (his) breast to disbelief -- on these is the wrath of Allah, and they shall have a grievous chastisement.


3.86 : How shall Allah guide a people who disbelieved after their believing and (after) they had borne witness that the Apostle was true and clear arguments had come to them; and Allah does not guide the unjust people.

3.87 : (As for) these, their reward is that upon them is the curse of Allah and the angels and of men, all together.

3.88 : Abiding in it; their chastisement shall not be lightened nor shall they be respited.

3.89 : Except those who repent after that and amend, then surely Allah is Forgiving, Merciful.

3.90 : Surely, those who disbelieve after their believing, then increase in unbelief, their repentance shall not be accepted, and these are they that go astray.


4.137 : Surely (as for) those who believe then disbelieve, again believe and again disbelieve, then increase in disbelief, Allah will not forgive them nor guide them in the (right) path.

Threat of punishment for not going to war
9.38 : O you who believe! What (excuse) have you that when it is said to you: Go forth in Allah's way, you should incline heavily to earth; are you contented with this world's life instead of the hereafter? But the provision of this world's life compared with the hereafter is but little.

9.39 : If you do not go forth, He will chastise you with a painful chastisement and bring in your place a people other than you, and you will do Him no harm; and Allah has power over all things.

48.16 : Say to those of the dwellers of the desert who were left behind: You shall soon be invited (to fight) against a people possessing mighty prowess; you will fight against them until they submit; then if you obey, Allah will grant you a good reward; and if you turn back as you turned back before, He will punish you with a painful punishment.

God making someone more sinful so he can be punished more
3.178 : And let not those who disbelieve think that Our granting them respite is better for their souls; We grant them respite only that they may add to their sins; and they shall have a disgraceful chastisement.

Intentionally preventing unbelievers from knowing the truth
6.25 : And of them is he who hearkens to you, and We have cast veils over their hearts lest they understand it and a heaviness into their ears; and even if they see every sign they will not believe in it; so much so that when they come to you they only dispute with you; those who disbelieve say: This is naught but the stories of the ancients.

6.110 : And We will turn their hearts and their sights, even as they did not believe in it the first time, and We will leave them in their inordinacy, blindly wandering on.

Intentionally preventing unbelievers from Understanding Koran
17.45 : And when you recite the Quran, We place between you and those who do not believe in the hereafter a hidden barrier;

17.46 : And We have placed coverings on their hearts and a heaviness in their ears lest they understand it, and when you mention your Lord alone in the Quran they turn their backs in aversion.

It is God who causes people to err and He burns them for that
17.97 : And whomsoever Allah guides, he is the follower of the right way, and whomsoever He causes to err, you shall not find for him guardians besides Him; and We will gather them together on the day of resurrection on their faces, blind and dumb and deaf; their abode is hell; whenever it becomes allayed We will add to their burning.


God could guide, if he chose to, but did not
6.35 : And if their turning away is hard on you, then if you can seek an opening (to go down) into the earth or a ladder (to ascend up) to heaven so that you should bring them a sign and if Allah had pleased He would certainly have gathered them all on guidance, therefore be not of the ignorant.

Allah Intentionally misguides
14.4 : And We did not send any apostle but with the language of his people, so that he might explain to them clearly; then Allah makes whom He pleases err and He guides whom He pleases and He is the Mighty, the Wise.

Willfully misguiding some
16.93 : And if Allah please He would certainly make you a single nation, but He causes to err whom He pleases and guides whom He pleases; and most certainly you will be questioned as to what you did.

God causes human to err
4.143 : Wavering between that (and this), (belonging) neither to these nor to those; and whomsoever Allah causes to err, you shall not find a way for him.

7.178 : Whomsoever Allah guides, he is the one who follows the right way; and whomsoever He causes to err, these are the losers.

God deceiving humans
4.142 : Surely the hypocrites strive to deceive Allah, and He shall requite their deceit to them, and when they stand up to prayer they stand up sluggishly; they do it only to be seen of men and do not remember Allah save a little.

 

RE: Go on then.

the fact you don't realise is disturbing(banghead)

 

RE: Go on then.

Have you got anything to say or are you just going to continue gibbering?

 

Me too!

It's not on!

Stop it right now Acky! (NOOO)

 

can i join you in idiot corner windy?

because i dont understand his point either

 

RE: Me too!

Dunno, just seems like basic common sense to me - Im not sure why its such a scary thing to agree with!

Still makes a change from feeling like this! -----------> (battered)

 

that failed bombers excuse is bollax

all 8 of the bombers were muslim that is more than a coincidence. nobody is going to tell me that they werent acting based on their religion, if that was the case then why would they try suicide bombings? they only go to paradise if it is in the name of allah.