John McDonnell

He's pretty much spot on here. Starmer and acolytes like McSweeney have ruined the Labour Party and taken it away from its core values and history. There'll be a big meltdown in the next election in my opinion. Reform on the right and the greens and even Lib Dems on the left (yes even the Lib Dems are more progressive). No doubt Starmer apologists (heyup Mr Kaht) will have some lame retort.

John McDonnell calls for grassroots leadership challenge to Starmer government https://www.theguardian.com/politic...adership-challenge-to-keir-starmer-government

 

Disagree. I'll tell you who has ruined the labour party and taken it away from its core values. The people who mocked and belittled Jeremy Corbyn and forced labour to move more and more to the right in order to gain power because anything else was ridiculed by the media and more importantly social media.

 

But is it better to have a right leaning labour government or a leftist labour opposition?
I don't like what's happening one little bit, but I think people should be pragmatic.

 

This....

I actually had a bit of a do with someone over this. Cos he's clearly a fartage lover.

I listed out the policies and ideas corbyn had, and asked him. Which of these do you not like. He couldn't answer, and actually thought they were decent. But he was swept up in all the bull*hit media that ridiculed him

And he's still at it today, loving fartage

 

This one. Nail on head, par excellence.

 

I pretty much agree. Our electoral system (should) lead people to pragmatism. Better a ‘bad’ labour than the alternatives surely. I rate the idea of a principled vote for Green/Lib Dem. But depending on seat it’s actually more likely to result in an overall outcome that would be worse surely. Also, broadly what @SuperTyke said is right and has led us to this position, along with a seeming global shift to the right.
I could be wrong mind!

 

The Tories and their billionaire newspaper owned cronies did such a fantastic job in discrediting JC that they should be applauded for convincing the public , that JC was not only a terrorist lover but anti British, who hadn't got Britain's best interests at heart.
The elite were flush with fear at the thought of him getting elected as they couldn't afford for him to get elected. such was the threat he posed to their power.
He puts most MP's to shame.
Hes not a weather vane politician unlike the majority of them
and of course he was stabbed in the back by the Tory infiltrators within the Labour party of which Starmer in my opinion is one
I reckon Starmer and Reeves will be gone before Christmas
Peacock and Jarvis another two who in my opinion are just carreer politicians.

 

Brexit, racism and bigotry have absolutely decimated all we know about the previous political incarnations including this Labour Party.

Brexit is still everything re imagined in a war against immigration, previously racists and bigots voted for parties such as Labour and the tories alike, no one was forced to choose politics based on imaginary foes… they are now. It doesn’t matter a jot what Labour / Starmer do on the economy, nhs or services, they’ve lost the battle already… any mention of the good work they are doing is shouted down. They haven’t helped themselves mind, policies are the most right wing you’ll ever see from a Labour government and they’ve lost all goodwill from floating voters. The Brexit lot once backing the tories have found a home in reform/ukip/bnp.

Labour should and could have back JC instead of tearing him apart from inside.

 

Come on, KCP. 'Deluded', 'in denial', and now 'lame'? Any chance I could have my own view without the personals?

Keir's been overwhelmingly elected, and by 2029 will have kept the Tories out for five years. McDonnell will still be baying from the sidelines.

 

The truth is it didn’t happen this way.

Starmer’s side of the party were plotting right from the start of Corbyn’s leadership to undermine him.

It was nothing to do with feeling that the public wanted them to move to the right.

It was to control the party & be able to have second jobs & to have earners like Labour Friends of Isreal & have jobs for life through the Lords system.

 

Right leaning !!! Quoting Enoch Powell , punishing the poor and disabled over his hedge fund backers , turning a blind eye to genocide , licking the arse of a white supremacist American President , Starmers not leaning he’s swimming with the far right

 

this sums exactly why it’s all fu**ed. The right wingers should absolutely love him! instead we’ve got a right wing populist leader of a private company masquerading as a political party telling everyone he’ll cut taxes and give all the money away. It’s utterly bonkers and utterly untrue but you don’t need facts anymore to get votes… just blame someone less well off than you.

 

This Labour government is exactly as those of us who left the party predicted they'd be. Not quite the Tories.

The rise of the far right is a worry, and we'll see if Keir and co can fend them off. I don't think they will. But there's plenty of time to do so.

Whoever runs their comms is a disaster. Childish nonsense on social media. Using photos of Farage etc. Legitimising him. It's so poor. If they want to retain power, they'd do well to remove that person and get back to grown-up politics, and get everything out there that shows the positive things they're doing. I have no idea who advised Starmer on the Enoch impression, but if it's the same person/people, I rest my case. Just that speech alone saw my colleague cancel his membership the other week. He plans to vote Lib Dem now. But I'll keep banging on about the Greens anyway.

Vote for what you believe in. That's all I do.

"But the left will never win."

Looks that way. But at least I can sleep at night knowing I didn't vote for a party who aids and abets Israel as it commits genocide. Just one example. There are many. Not few.

 

He should piss off and join his buddy Corbyn on the independent benches the two of them and those with the same hard left beliefs have kept the Labour party out of power by causing them to fail to win elections they could and should have won over the years. Labour wins when clowns like him are as far away from controlling the party as possible.

 

The sweet irony is the biggest clown we've had in years was in control of Labours most recent victory.

 

I will say it again. You will never tax a country to wealth.

What you are seeing isn’t a rise of the ‘far right’. You can have a productive and healthy debate about illegal immigration / fraudulent benefits claimants etc and the impact it has on the country you live and pay your taxes in, without being ‘far right’.

I by no means would say Mr Farage would be a great PM but dare I say it, the way some media portray him has echoings of how the media portrayed Arthur scargill - as the enemy within .

 

Quelle surprise. Austerity, perks, attacking the vulnerable and no ideas on growth except some 'fiscal rule' crap that's likely to be broken anyway. If you can't see the Tories in sheep's clothing you've gone blind pal. I told you this implosion would happen with a liar and unprincipled charlatan as leader but you wouldn't have it simply because the label says 'Labour'. Labour have been ruined my friend. Clinging on to them because of a label is naive in the extreme. McDonnell is correct but I suspect he'll not be heeded and the demise will continue.

 

He could 'piss off' as you eloquently put it but he'd still be correct if he did.

 

Do they? I'd say he's the darling of the media, for a party of such a minority of seats, he gets an inordinate amount of non critical coverage.

 

Sorry, missed this post. Yes, deluded, in denial and lame are apt. I'm sure you're jolly, decent, sporting and affable too. However, you are so blinded by the fact that the Tories are out that you've failed to see that the Tories are back in. Simple as that but you can't see it.