Negative or realistic?

Much is being made of the negativity on this board after our poor start to the season. I didn't see any of the pre-season games and generally feel that you learn very little from them. I've seen some great pre-seasons where I've been full of optimism and we've gone on to endure a poor season and conversely we've had some poor ones and then gone on to have a fine season.
The one result that did however put me in a fairly confident mood for the season (I even backed us in the handicap) was the 5 0 demolition of Scunthorpe. I'd imagine that raised a few eyebrows (and hopes).
I attended the Forest game and was fairly impressed with our attempts at playing pass and move football (even if it was mostly in our own half). We also looked much more solid as a team. I did wonder though, looking at the make up of the side, just where our goals were going to come from? The two home games this past week have really highlighted the goalscoring problem and killed off any optimism I had felt. Can anyone say with all honesty that we have anyone to play in midfield who is capable of more than a couple of goals throughout the season? Ally that with a forward line that lacks a natural finisher and it isn't rocket science that we are going to struggle. The system that we are trying to play lacks proper width to me. Pace on the flanks would seem an absolute must to play it successfully. A midfield four of Doyle, Addison, Butterfield and Perkins is about as slow as you could get. O Brien would make very little difference, Done looked out of his depth against Morecambe and Vaz Te lacks the work rate to play there. Davies looks lost as a lone striker playing with his back to goal. he needs a target man alongside him to play off. As for Haynes, he sure has pace but his first touch is abysmal. He looks to me as if he can't wait to get out of the club. His agent also appears to be engineering a move for him.
All which makes up for a right royal mess and i haven't even mentioned our defensive and goalkeeping deficiencies. This is not negativity, it's realism. Keith Hill has a lot of work to do over the coming months.
He can certainly talk the talk but can he walk the walk?

 

As you say, over the coming months, time will tell.

Don't really agree about Haynes like.

 

don't really agree about the back four neither.looks as though we not gonna concede many once their bedded in

 

Have supporters turned on the team because they had their expectations built up too high by a decent pre-season. Are those who said that by buying from a lower division would mean that the team would end up in that division simply trying to prove that they were right to the rest of this board. Are those who said that the cub were wrong to let Robins go trying to convince us that they too know more about the game than the club owner and provider of our capital does. Is being seen to be right as judged by fellow posters on this forum more important to some people than the overall welfare of the club. Is patience a virtue, or are those who advocate patience simply numpties and yes-men. Are those who sit on the ponty and sing when we're winning better supporters of the club than those in the East stand who do not, even if they boo when we're losing.

I do not suggest that in the heat of the moment, and when things are going badly it is always possible to react logically. All that I would ask is that supporters consider whether their actions are helping the team and its management to achieve what we all want. However, when two days later, supporters still have not managed to control their emotions and think about what they are saying, I question whether they have the best interests of the club at heart.

I do not know why I have posted this here because compared with most of the stuff I have read on here, your post is mild. I guess I simply needed to get it off my chest. By the way, your post is not negative. Neither is it realistic. It is opinion, as is almost everything on here.

 

Good post.

Only point to raise is about the owner. Does he know more about the game than you?

 

thats what the forums all about differences of opinion i don't agree with a lot of the stuff on here but i'd defend and repect their right to say it and i enjoy giving em my opinion back.10,000 people at a football will have 10,000 views thats life.i don't think pc himself proffeses to know more about football than most of the fans

 

The reason for the negativity is the standard of football played in the last two matches which has been poor,we beat Boro tomorrow and four points from the first three matches won't be a bad return.Its not the fans putting pressure on the players ,they are doing it to themselves ,you don't score goals in your own half

 

Red Rain

You seem to imply that you would have liked to come on here and say " See PC does know what he is doing, "
We dont have to agree with everything the club does, I dont think for one minute that Patrick Cryne is as God like as he seems to be on here. He gets things wrong and I believe he has got it wrong now.
Hill has got it very wrong in the last 2 games and it is up to him to prove the doubtors wrong.
I think some people had very good cause to be concerned about what was going to happen this season, the team lacks any true quality, any semblance of an attacking threat and plays slow meaningless passing football along the back 4.
I would love to see us play like Barca, etc but we cannot do it without some sort of attacking gulie. Mix it up a bit, get the ball into the channels, make the opponents think about what is coming next, because at the moment all the other team have to do is push up and wait till we mis place a pass then take the ball back, we are too predictable. Even Morecambe were able to nullify us, Southampton gave us as big a 1-0 thrashing as you will see. 4 central midfielders and a striker in midfield is bloody crazy, Haynes looked as though he did not have a clue what he was doing, same as Doyle, Perkins is not a wide man, came inside way too much.
But one of the most worrying things was Hill seemed at a loss as to what happened and why after the match, I have never heard a manger say that they were alone before, well not on his home league deut anyway. THAT WORRIED me.

 

the ppl calling for others to do this or do that, baffle me..
there are just over 7500 ST holders this year according to the kind lady i spoke to last week.. thats a lot of individuals.. we are not robots, we all pay our hard earned, and we all support the club, but have many ways of showing it..

the amazing thing is the amount that say they didnt boo.. really? well, there was a hell of a lot that did.. i think some are too pussy or ashamed to admit it.. i didnt boo per say, but i did shout a few remarks that im not proud of such as:
at least twice towards JayMac i said (didnt shout it, but said it loudly) "what tha doing McEveley!?"
then i said this after id finally got sick of seeing Preece launching it up to Haynes "what the fcuks point in that?! a-fcukin-gain!"

and my favourite line that i repeated whilst holding my head in hands "oh my days...."

so yeah, the atmosphere even got to me, and i got a little too angry.. but im the biggest reds fan there is IMOO, so just cos i got carried away thru sheer desperation doesnt make me a bad supporter.. its different strokes for different folks.. so i dont agree with all these BETTER fans, telling fellow reds off..
if we can accept or put the display down to being 'just a bad day at the office',
then surely we can use that same attitude towards the fans that apparently let us down..?..? just a bad day for them (me included maybe) also..

hey-ho, keep the faith.. UREDS

 

Good post, OMB! And I agree - it's not negativity, it's realism.

I think Hill seems a real nice guy - quirky, enthusiastic, and convinced of his own ideas. On a personal level I would wish him nothing but success. However, that makes it all the more disconcerting that he is already sounding bemused and somewhat depressed! It's worrying that that's where Davey and Robins both got to, but after a lot more games!

Longer term, the game will benefit when all clubs have to abide by the financial stability rules, but for the moment we're trying to compete in a league where the other participants are still using what resources they have - or in some cases that they don't have - to improve their teams. We've jumped early, and we are already being caught by another old Barnsley truism - "tha gets what tha pays for!"

On the boo boys - some will find it surprising, but I don't do this. I tend to watch the games quietly and reflect on what I'm seeing! If I utter any comment it's to myself - under my breath! My favourite, whilst I had my ST in the ESL was the old boy in front who had a rubber-tipped walking stick. At moments of tension/disappointment the old boy tended to bang his stick on the ground. Being rubber-tipped, it made no sound but I think he got his frustrations out that way! Think I'll get one of them sticks!

One more point - it seems the "faithful" are now trying to deride us cynics by suggesting that we want BFC to play like Barcelona! Well, actually, to play like Danny's team of 96-97 wouldn't be too much to ask, would it? That team was assembled on the cheap, but mixed youth and experience - at several levels - and produced a brand of pass and move football that hasn't been seen at the Well since. Maybe the Blunts are about to experience that approach?

 

Re: Red Rain

Mr Cryne must know more than us because he has the oportunity to hold those who are running of club on a day to day basis to account. All that we can do is to listen to the questions posed on our behalf in interviews by the media and try to read between the lines. Generally, all you get in these interviews is cliche and enthusiasm. The interviewee generally does not want to say anything that can later be held against him when things go wrong. He does not want to tell the media frankly what he believes are the team's strengths and weaknesses because of the effect this would have on the morale of the players and the information that is gifted to future opponents. Supporters think that they should know everything about their club, but this is just not practical. However, when you are the owner you expect to receive information from the people in charge that is accurate and honest.

Not only is the above true, it is also true that Mr Cryne is the only person who knows what he wants to invest in the club in future, and how well he thinks his past investment was spent by those who were given those funds. To be honest, if supporters told me how to spend my money I would be tempted to do a lot more than ignore them. At the end of last season Mark Robins was told what his budget would be for this season. He decided to walk rather than accept the challenge. I suspect he thought that the budget meant that the club would be relegated and that his reputation would be ruined as a result. Hillcroft came in and were willing to take up the challenge, even though the same is true for them. I think that their willingness to put their careers on the line means that they deserve to be given the time to blend the new players in before they are given the abuse that has appeared on here since things went pear-shaped in the Morecambe game. They have put their reputation on the line when Mark Robins was not prepared to. The least that supporters of Barnsley football club should be prepared to do is to give them time.

 

Re: Red Rain

I can only say that the days of Mr Cryne investing or underwriting seem to be over and quite right too. Where that leaves us, we shall see.

 

It would be great to see the team play like Danny Wilson's team of 96-97 did. Those old memories are always fantastic. However, that was not Danny's first season. As I recall it, he arrived as a player and assistant manager with Viv Anderson as player manager some three seasons before. I remember they tried things in that first season that did not come off. I remember the team struggled, and at one stage looked as though it would be relegated. I also remember the dog's abuse that Danny got from the Oakwell faithful for his performances in central midfield that season. I also remember that Anderson left at the end of that first season to be assistant manager at Middlesborough, in similar circumstance to those that faced Mark Robins this summer. I remember that, at the time, the appointment of Danny Wilson was seen as a cost saving exercise. The Oakwell faithful expected him to fail and greeted his appointment with disdain. Fortunately, they were wrong. Perhaps they should have learned from this experience that they should have been more patient.