Well. Whatever our unbiased press and political and economic commentators....

...have to say on the subject (Robinson, Peston and Flanders for the BBC), it would appear that Cameron may well have done the right thing.

Firstly, one or two leaders of other countries are now starting to have second thoughts about the 'Treaty within a Treaty'.
Secondly, the markets seem to agree on that, share prices seem to be largely stable and the pound has hit over 1.19 euros to the £ for the first time in years.
As someone who is a floating voter (I vote for the one I think will do the least damage) I believe about 40% of what the coalition is doing is along the right lines. As for Millibland, well he did not even have the courage of his conviction to say, when pressed, what he would have done i.e. to Veto or to sign. Zero credibility and I shudder to think what he would have done at the meeting. Merkozy would have eaten him alive!
When, oh! when will we get a credible opposition that we could realistically vote for? I can see a 'full on', idealogically driven, right wing Conservative Government in power after the next election without the (albeit faulty) handbrake that is the LibDems, restraining the excesses that they would otherwise have inflicted on us (as if what they have done up to now is moderate!)

 

but how could you vote for them....the shame!..... we are barnsley people, we don't think, we just vote labour don't we!!

In general i applaud your views sir.

hope this helps people think for themselves and not just do as 'Barnsley' people are supposed to. Vote for who YOU want is what i say...whether it be REd, Blue or pink with black spots on!

 

That is the problem. As a man I have the greatest of respect for Dan Jarvis. He speaks very well, has life experience (and how!) and , ignoring the recent award for this lifesaving 'innovation' which sounds more like common sense to me, has still done enough in my eyes to put him well above the average career MP. Why oh why then has he joined a party with a front bench populated by clueless 'numpties'( unless naively he thinks it is a 'meritocracy' and he can change it into an efficient fighting unit)?

 

Be careful, measured and broadminded political views are often frowned upon by the militant socialist elite on here especially if there is even a hint of applauding something Dave and his Tories have done.

 

Unbiased view

I think you may have missed the point here. Share price? Strength of the Euro? Doubts about the "treaty"?
It's a little bit more important than that. If the euro collapses in a disorderly way it will be catastrophic for everyone. It is in our interests for an orderly dismantling/reordering of currencies in Europe. Cameron has quite simply refused to be in the discussions about this so we will get what other people decide. He was "eaten alive " by Markosy. The French got exactly what they wanted and we just ran up the white flag.
As for the Labour leadership? It is very weak at the moment. The wrong Miliband is leader!

P.S. This is a biased view (everyone has a bias!). With the Toffs in power it's only going to get far worse for places like Barnsley.

 

Re: Unbiased view

i'll be ok down here in Sandbanks!!

 

Hold on a minute

Why did Cameron veto the deal?

To protect the City of London's Financial Institutions.


Who caused the mess in the first place?

The City of London's Financial Institutions (amongst others).

Has he done it to protect Britain's manufacturing Industry and the ordinary people in the street?

No.

Ar*ehole.

 

Aren't you complaining about those that complain about the Tory B@stards?

 

As part of your "miltant socialist elite" (an oxymoron, surely) I would say that I applaud the "Plonker" in walking out from the talks. The only downside is that it is a typical half arsed Cameron measure that leaves us in a bit of no-mans land as things stand. I'd have the referendum NOW on coming out of the capitalist club.

If the markets are happy with what he has done then who are we to argue. They have never been know to be wrong though have they? Are we saying that these unelected and largely unaccountable and ungoverned "institutions" hold more sway over the economic policy of the UK than the Government itself?

 

Re: Hold on a minute

Agreed. Like I say, a typical half arsed call me Dave measure. Pull the plug, now. EU legislation is used now as an excuse to prevent nationalisation and direct support of struggling companies. This despite EDF being majortity owned by the French State and now being the largest energy supplier in the UK. Nice1

 

Re: Hold on a minute

"Ar*ehole. "
Me or Cameron??

Unfortunately, the Banking and financial sector provides a considerable proportion of our tax revenue. Don't think just about the bankers (and we all agree they are immoral, unethical, plain greedy and need regulating) but think outside the square mile i.e Birmingham, Leeds, Manchester etc. where there are building societies, Insurance companies who generate huge amounst of revenue. Also a lot of the banks in London are NOT UK ones.

We also have to consider all the pension funds etc so it is not, unfortunately a question of Tories looking after their pals which the Left wing press would have you believe.

In terms of the fortunes of the financial services we really ARE (unfortunately) all in it (the ****) together.

As I said I am not a fan of this government, they have made things far worse in many areas largely through ideology that makes Thatcher look moderate. However in this instance, I think he did the right thing. Incidentally, and note it does not indicate whether you are right or wrong, but public opinion across the board, shows the majority supporting what he did. Time will tell.

 

Re: Hold on a minute

Of course the markets agree on it, that's who Cameron is defending, his own Eton boys in the city. That's what it's all about, keeping regulation away from the banking industry to protect the boys. Regulation that would have prevented the mess in the first place but they don't want to bring it in now.
The Lib dems should stop propping up this self-centred Tory government NOW and force an election.

 

Re: Hold on a minute

The majority support what he did because of jingoism, IMHO

 

Re: Hold on a minute

i personally don't care who is in power...they are all as bad as each other and innit for themselves.

I am more bothered about stopping the salty sea breeze blowing into the apartment...i must get the triple glazing looked at....perils of sandbanks beachside living i suppose. Never Mind eh?

hope this helps

 

Re: Unbiased view

I disagree in part. We are not in the Eurozone so would not have been able to vote or hold any sway over decisions made that affect the Eurozone. In fact only a few weeks before Markozy were telling Cameron to 'keep off the grass' whilst they were discussing the way forward for that very reason. I fully agree that a Euro collapsing in a chaotic manner would be bad (although not sure as bad as they are naking out. Personally I think it is inevitable that it will not continue in its present form as none of the leaders have the will to really do what needs to be done and that involves the ECB. Nor do I believe this treaty will actually come into existence with all members except UK (although time alone will tell) as some are already backtracking.

Unfortunately, the strength of the £ (or more to the point the weakness of the Euro) is the important fact. I don't know where you have been for the past few months but it is clear that the markets DO have the power to bring down entire countries economies. It is nothing to do with 'conspiracies' but a simple fact that most countries are now massively indebted to lovberseas investors. Like any mortgagee they are now at the mercy of the IOU holder and market confidence is what is driving all this given that we are dealing with 'funny money'.

What Britain needs to be doing in the borropwed time before the inevitable happens, ie. the breakup of the eurozone as it stands is work flat out to 'big up Britain and secure other markets, e.g. India, Asia, Africa, Commonwealth - a task I admit that will be difficult esopecially as a Weak Euro vs a stromng pound makes that even harder. However a AAA rating is a pretty strong card as, again it is about confidence.

Finally, I totally agree that Conservatives idea of the nations wealth is based on the country's balance sheets, with much focus on the South East prosperity in particular whilst the rest of the country, Scotland and Wales are seen as an irrelevance. We are treated as 'below the salt' and get a few scraps - an example being 20 year old, 3rd hand cast off rolling stock from the South for our Northern railway network whilst they get new investment.

 

This sums up my views

The notion that he is protecting high street banks is ridiculous by the way, he is protecting a square mile of Britain that is called the City of London. And only some of it. And he's even failed to do that. The Europe issue has done for Thatcher and Major and hopefully Cameron too.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2011/dec/11/will-hutton-david-cameron-wrong-on-europe

 

Re: Unbiased view

Are you serious Bright Red ??? The French got what the Germans told them to get - they'r ein this mess up to their heads - too much exposure to Greek debt triple A going going gone .... THEY HAVE NO CHOICE ..... they've become Germany's poodle ..... And the little dwarf tried to bully us into folowing their only possible line ..... We had the choice - they didn't ....

eaten Alive?? - about as wrong as you could get

 

Re: Hold on a minute

Someone on here actually said that he vetoed it to protect the banks from legislation. Actually (Not for one minute do I believe he will invoke it) but the Treaty would have prevented the British Government from implementing measures in the Vickers report that are MORE not less restrictive than what is in the Treaty.

My view has always been that everyone is entitled to their own opinion, but at least they should make an INFORMED one and not just formed by reading a single newspaper or source.
Why do you say you are biased out of curiosity? You don't come across as a numpty so do you honestly believe EVERYTHING one party does is wrong and the opposition, therefore is right on everything.

The thing that scares me the most about this government is that they have managed to dismantle 100 years of hard fought employee rights in 10 months in the name of 'competitiveness'. Wat is the point of a wealthy (on paper) economy if the majority of people are working at , or under peverty level wages. Downton Abbey might be an aspiration for this present lot oh! and workhouses.

 

Re: Unbiased view

I can recommend a good eaterie in Dorset if that helps any of you calm down. Nice glass of chardonnay and a light lunch anyone?

hope this helps

 

Re: Hold on a minute

They would love a return to these Victorian values. That is what Thatcher always aspired to!