Another Interesting Court Case (Brexit)...

But why turn to the right, which continues the same economic system but blames it on the fear of the other, rather than the left? Trade unionism has a proud history of rejecting the far right in this country

 

The 'ruling elite' need to keep the working class from striking out at those who are keeping them in 'their place', instead of hitting up they create an under class and say it's all their fault, blame them.

So many said they wanted to smash the ruling elite, so many thought they had - look at that elite - Farage, Ian Duncan-Smith, Boris Johnson and Gove. White, Upper Class, Public School educated, sons of wealthy families who inherited their wealth. Yeah, you really shoved it to them didn't you, you showed them.

Duped and kept in your place.

 

please tell me,how you feel I have been duped,please bear in mind that i cant stand any of that list you mention.

 

Selfishness, greed and ignorance in equal measures. Not necessarily saying that people are stupid, but we don't have the full understanding of the issues involved to make an informed decision about what is best for the entire country over the longer term and not just for themselves or today. This isn't helped with inflammatory press headlines and the cult of personality around certain politicians who are no different in background or political views from the other politicians they are meant to oppose.

The Right usually promises to cut tax, save jobs or stop immigrants - all of which appeal to people who are struggling and feel neglected by politicians who are out of touch. Usually though this is achieved at the expense of public services (selling off government assets to pay for tax cuts) or cuts to benefits (raised pension ages, benefit caps) which leaves the people that need them most worse off in the long term.

The Left should offer an alternative but it is often easy for the press to find examples that make a mockery of the loony-left and benefits scroungers are all over the media. People perceive the left as weak and as we've seen there is a major smear campaign against Corbyn along with open revolt in his party. Not saying that he is the answer, but Farage, Gove and Johnson are certainly not the answer that the working class are looking for.

 

Something of us on this board have been pushing the left wing case against EU membership for many months , perhaps you haven't read it ( I know the referendum discussion thread is not available now )
but it has been there . Benn , Skinner and Corbyn have argued virtually their whole lives against The EU ,
sadly Tony died before the referendum , Dennis has continued the fight despite being hideously caricatured by The Guardian , a slur that I will never forget or forgive, a slur that tells a truth more about the current management of the rag than it does on Skinner . Corbyn however has been in an awful situation , I don't agree with all of JC's policies or opinions , but the fact that Labour's career professionals , the people that could slip comfortably and without embarrassment in to any party that could further their career's , have been stabbing him in the back for so long has forced him to a position that has been unhelpful to balanced free debate in the most important question for 40 years.
It seems OK for Remainers to say to those who wish to be free of The EU...you agree with the right wing , but the reality of it is Remainers have thrown their hat in with Cameron and Osborne , and the Juncker's and Schulz's who are prepared to happily see Greece and others sacrificed on the high altar .

 

Well said. The EU is no friend of the working class.

 

In what way?

 

Because it facilitates this sort of behaviour

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/b...-story-making-the-headlines-this-9854958.html

Its whole set up is to allow multinationals to move capital and labour about to where they enjoy the greater benefits at the expense of the local populace.

 

The local populace can work there and should be given preference, but is it better to build a factory and employ people that spend money into the local economy or build the factory elsewhere and the area lose out on the investment to build the factory and employees spending money there.

The alternative is to pay higher wages, but then your sandwiches cost more.

 

"The alternative is to pay higher wages, but then your sandwiches cost more. "

Yep, and so with any other product - now, as a traditional socialist Labour supporting lot - do we want to pay a bit extra to support the working class or are we happy to see jobs and production migrate to where things are cheapest ? Which sounds a fairly Tory idea to me.

 

multinationals and their eu puppets that throw in a few sweetners like maternity and paternity pay to keep the populace onside,

 

the pay more wages but pay more for you sarnie is a valid argument..Whilst we champion the minimum wage as being a moral argument most consumers want their sarnie for the same price as say twenty years ago(even longer in some cases).
the problem we have in this country is that most of the well paid working class jobs dissapeared over the last 30 odd years,simply to be replaced by service industries,supplying consumer demand that wants everything at a knock down price,this is the real reason wages are depressed(not simply because every employer is a capitalist exploiter of the working class).we cant have it both roads,so to speak.

 

No we can't. We want our gadgets - produced cheaply in the Far East, sometimes under questionable regimes, we want our food muck cheap, but then we want everyone to have a comfortable standard of living (at least). Need to be asking ourselves some tough questions.

Globalisation if left unchecked will lead to reactionary forces coming to the fore. The EU (imho) provides no answers except more of the same free movement of capital which isn't taxed or invested in the country that it is produced, and will become more insular as time goes on, preventing to a larger degree open trade with Africa for example which prevents that continent developing.

 

What's on the sandwich?

 

step outside the bubble..
Look at what is happening in the EU.
Look at the rise of the PVV in the Netherlands, NF in France, Jobbik in Hungary, Afd in Germany etc. Look if you dare at what is happening in Greece.

This potential dangerous move to the Right was the reason I voted Leave. Those who carp about not knowing about the implications of Leaving should consider what might be the state of things if we Remain. In the next 18 months the EU will gradually collapse.

 

Yes it will

 

And strict limits on working hours, 20 days paid leave per year, equal treatment for part-time workers, parental leave (special leave to look after kids), TUPE protection, protection from discrimination.

Plus other numerous H&S laws and equal pay for equal work.

 

Are you saying that you just like British racist and far right groups?

 

These would more than likely have been introduced anyway

 

aye,that strict you can opt out,ffs theres loads of people having to work extra hours just to make ends meet,as for holidays,i seem to remember that most of us had them,courtesy of the unions more than anything,nowt to do with junker and co.
the eu has sat by and watched all the well paid working class jobs disappear,most of it to fckin china where companies dont have to implement the rules you mention,thus making our companies uncompetetive.
if the eu really did look out for the working class they'd do summat about a situation that allows imports from parts of the world that treat their workforce like sh!te,morals are alright so long as they just stick to them here.