Bottom line on Trump...

The key point, that is easily missed, is that he isn't saying that the left are wrong but they are failing to win the debate because they aren't engaging properly and are misunderstanding what is going on amongst voters. I agree with him. It's about how the left is letting the right write the narrative. He isn't saying we shouldn't call out racist attitudes and statements when they're made. He's saying that we should be challenging the simple arguments of the right that blame minorities and those without power for the failings of neo liberalism. Not dismissing people's fear and concerns out of hand, but providing reasoned debate and policy that cuts off the opportunism of the far right.

Trade unions were the vital tool in the past in doing this. They don't have the influence or reach now. It needs progressive social movements at the grass roots in communities, people engaging in discussion and debate.

 

Agree with you about Trump ,he was a massive contributor to the democrats once.
Trumps a difficult character to call imo.
He has a heart contrary to his latest ramblings but is also a control freak.
As for the left not mobilising and influencing protest/ policy,its because of their decline there's no organisation,
Union's and left organisations have been eradicated from close communities for this purpose and as far as the right are concerned now is the time to make it pay.
People who were at the very least sceptical of the lefts past protests are now realising the consequences of the void and the feeble attempts of the liberals to halt the exploitation and greed of the right and it's alliances.

 

Could agree with the contents of your post generally but as it's from the man who incessantly calls anyone supporting Corbyn loony lefties etc, it seems a bit self shotinfootery tbh.
Seems you personally could be included in the subject your ranting about imo.

 

There's virtually no mechanism at all for the left to protest. Certainly not in the States, as far as I can see. As soon as the Democrats decided to oust Bernie and go with Clinton that was that. When there are only two credible parties, what do the left do when their option suddenly goes right of centre? It's the biggest demonstration of the illusion of democracy yet. Powerful people just deciding what the 'options' will be.

The ex coal mining communities of Harlan County, once a stronghold of unions and Democrat voting, voted Trump. This says it all. Voting for Clinton wouldn't have achieved anything for them.

 

:frown:I don't think' incessantly' is totally accurate regarding Corbyn (only recall using Looney lefties once and that was only very recently)

Wrong thing to do I admit (and apologise) although I hold my hand up to having lost my cool once or twice. In all fairness, I have been called a 'vile human being', 'vile racist', 'bitter twisted racist' simply for starting the odd debate on topics like the Immigration situation in Italy. I strongly deny being racist so I would have to be a saint to not react to those accusations from people who have never met me.

Banging on...Guilty!
Verbose! Definitely guilty!

Never initiate verbal abuse and name calling unless severely provoked (even then I admit I should exercise control) but there are those on here who are far worse.

 

Are you suggesting the decision to elect Trump was an informed and sensible one?

 

Are you saying that only the informed and the sensible can vote?

 

No. If you read what I posted that is clearly not what I said. I said we should be doing more to educate and inform. Do you disagree?

 

That's all well and good if the information is not biased and one sided as to put forward only your point. People are different, culture, beliefs , religion, some people don't integrate because of this . This causes distrust and division in countries