He owes us nothing

Discussion in 'Bulletin Board' started by orsenkaht, Feb 7, 2018.

  1. red

    redrum Well-Known Member

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    He owes us abit more respect it's just like he has stuck 2s up at us. Lee johnson went to the club he loves and got horrible abuse, Sam winnall had no affiliation to our club left for a rival got pelters and even a toy pig thrown at him. Hecky was supposed to be one of us leaves to go Leeds takes half the backroom staff with him and says it was an easy decision. Double standards by s9me he makes Sam winnall look like a saint.
    And what did u expect from the new owners spend millions in the window and give a manager with 1 win in 16 30k a week.
     
    Last edited: Feb 7, 2018
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  2. wak

    wakeyred Well-Known Member

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    The new owners have backed Hecky, despite the utterly abysmal form which would have got any other manager the sack, by getting in the players he wanted and giving him an improved contract. In return he has left the club at the end of the January window with us 4th bottom and taken the first team staff with him, I'd say people have every right to be angry. What he's done for the club in the past is of little comfort set against his actions this week.
     
  3. Wat

    WatfordRed Well-Known Member

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    He owes us a bit of respect as the club he supposedly supports.
    He owe us a bit of loyalty given we supported him through an awful run.
    He owes it to us not to be a man with double standards who will criticise a player for doing what Winnall did and then doing it himself.
    He owes it to us not to move to our rivals 2 days after signing a new contract.
    He owes it to us to not come out and say it was an easy decision.
    He owes it to us to not lie about committing his future to the club.
    He owes it to us to not try and grab all the playing staff from under our feet a few days before the biggest game of the season.

    When people like Dennis Wise and Ian Wright who have no affiliation with our club can see that he’s stitched us up I don’t see how a fellow fan can’t.
     
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  4. Redstar

    Redstar Well-Known Member

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    Ill remember this the next time folks like you call for patience for the next head coach with 1 win in 16. We owe them NOTHING

    I’ve backed him totally. Argued with folk about recruitment, about why we’ve been *****. Won’t do it again. Loyalty isn’t worth owt. **** EM
     
    Last edited: Feb 7, 2018
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  5. RedKestrel

    RedKestrel Well-Known Member

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    His departure is a blessing in disguise.. he knew he weren't far off from the sack .
     
  6. Jimmy cricket

    Jimmy cricket Well-Known Member

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    Backed in what way?

    The incomings in January were 2 loanees.

    A Free transfer.

    3 players cost 1.5 million my estimate. Covered by selling MacDonald.

    Investment nothing.
     
  7. wak

    wakeyred Well-Known Member

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    MacDonald wasn't getting a game even though clearly fit, so unless someone can provide concrete reasoning for that we can say Hecky didn't want him so the club moved him on - which sounds like they've backed him there.
    How much did Mcburnie cost in wages? Before we signed him the word was that he would go to whoever was willing to pay the most of his 20k wages.
     
  8. JLWBigLil

    JLWBigLil Well-Known Member

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    They brought in six new players and then awarded the Head Coach with a new contract that he was happy to sign.
    As far as I'm concerned, the new board have done nothing wrong. Not a thing.
     
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  9. orsenkaht

    orsenkaht Well-Known Member

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    "“Everyone knows my affiliation with Barnsley, but when I signed on the dotted line to become a manager, I was going to be exiting Barnsley at some point, whether it was getting sacked or moving on."

    The contract. I'm no expert on these things, but it would be my understanding that had Hecky not signed the new contract then the compensation payment would have been linked in some way to his salary and the remaining length of his existing contract. I am assuming the new contract gave him 300k - 350k pa. The new contract (same rolling term) provided for a 500k release clause. If I'm correct on that he did us a favour by signing. If Leeds were prepared to pay Paul 1M pa then somebody has got his value wrong. If Leeds were out by 50% we've still offered him half of what he is worth.

    He must have known. If Christiansen had have beaten Cardiff then doesn't he stay? The situation changed quickly. Hecky took the opportunity offered to him.

    Staff. I've rarely if ever heard anyone on here mention the names of our backroom staff up until this episode. Suddenly they are like the crown jewels that have been prised from us. Don't the better managers almost always take the staff they are used to working with? And don't many incoming managers insist on having their own people? It's not a big deal.

    Transfers. I deeply hope that the new lads come off and help us achieve safety. But Knasmllner wasn't even in the squad on Saturday. Mahoney is only 20 and McBurnie hasn't scored a goal for three years. Like I say, I hope they come good but the jury is still out on whether we went to any lengths to try and really shore the team up. It's underwhelming to say the least, but they may turn out to be OK.

    Judging the new owners too harshly? This is the most subjective bit. It's early days, but in addition to that potentially underwhelming January activity (which may or may not turn out OK) they have allowed one of the best managers we've had to slip from our grasp. For me they have work to do.
     
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  10. Spuggy

    Spuggy Well-Known Member

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    And both Winnall and LJ came out and gave their thanks to the club after (in Winnalls case it was probably wrote for him). I'm absolutley astounded that Heckingbottom has said nothing about the club or the fans or anything. Not that it would make a difference mind, but it's just a shocking lack of class.
     
  11. Redstar

    Redstar Well-Known Member

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    Follow him to Leeds. He might need some arse lickers especially when they lose a few.

    You are changing positions to back a snake. Suddenly all the signings are *****. Last week it was good business.
     
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  12. orsenkaht

    orsenkaht Well-Known Member

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    I didn't say they were ***** (to use your phrase). I just said they did not correspond to us pushing the boat out to avoid the drop. I don't see that as being inconsistent with my former (and current) view that they should hopefully improve the squad. But there are some questions about the extent of the ambition they demonstrate.
     
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  13. gaz180

    gaz180 Active Member

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    Owes us nothing ? We owe him a kick in the ballax , I hope chokes and ends up as a ball boy at the wendys
     
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  14. Dan

    DannyWilsonLovechild Well-Known Member

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    Let's start to judge things in the cold light of day with the benefit of hindsight now. Let's try and forget he was born in Barnsley, because let's face it, that meant nothing to his loyalty, so it shouldn't be used to give him the benefit of assessing his performance.

    He won promotion, fantastic. The squad was inherited, but he continued to gel the team and we got better and better as confidence grew. He won the JPT taking over for one game against a team a division below us. Fantastic day out.

    We then stayed up, despite our key players leaving en masse.

    In terms of his character, its fair to say he's deeply unmotivating as a speaker, something he has said numerous times, in disliking the spotlight and not liking the PR stuff, he just wants to be a coach, he never wanted to manage in the first place (his own words). His tone is pretty dour, bland, lacking in wit and humour. He's been clearly unhappy for a very long time but has kept that from the public glare but his interviews have been more and more negative, to the point of his final interview to celebrate his new contract having barely a small smile running through it recounting those fantastic achievements mentioned above.

    His win record isn't great, and this season, let's call it what it is, the football has been pretty dire and negative. Blame the players by all means, but if getting the best out of average players is the measure, what Hill and Flitcroft did was beyond miracle.

    Think back in his earlier days, he talked of identity, of consistently having a team that meets the Barnsley DNA, of everyone knowing their positions, of having consistency through the levels so when players hit the first team, they know what to do.

    If that was his early thinking, it doesn't reflect this season where we've tried so many variants on a theme, systems, shapes, styles and we've failed at all of them. Players out of position regularly, mass changes from game to game, odd substitutions. In terms of wins, the last year has been dreadful. In terms of entertainment, this year has been dreadful.

    Yet I would've continued to support him and want him to shape the squad. But at the time he has left, ignoring morality of how the contract came about, why he delayed for months, changed agents and suddenly in 24-48 hours he and many of his backroom staff signed a deal at a club he is on open record as hating, you look at his record and his actions and the only way you can say he was one of our best, is if you continue to judge him as a Barnsley fan on the first 6-8 months of his reign, someone we've produced and hope upon hope he delivers like the first year of his tenure.

    Personally, in my time there are many managers who've been much better, Clarke, Hunter, Machin, Wilson, Bassett, Ritchie, Davey, maybe Robins... i'd even argue Hill and Flitcroft were comparable.

    I'd even say if Heckingbottom was critiqued through the same lens afforded to Keith Hill, Heckingbottom wouldn't have made it through last season. Likewise, if Hill was afforded the luxuries of being one of our own, he may even still be manager.
     
    Last edited: Feb 7, 2018
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  15. Jimmy cricket

    Jimmy cricket Well-Known Member

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    I completely agree. We continued to live within our means following the plan and it’s the right thing to do. The board is right to continue the good work set up by Patrick. It’s right for us protects the future and gives us solidity.

    At the same time I can see the attraction of managing a team without those restrictions. Without the need to be so stringent in balancing the books that will pay me more and offer me a longer contract.
     
  16. JLWBigLil

    JLWBigLil Well-Known Member

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    As someone who was proud to publicly back Hecky 100%, he's left and I feel nothing towards him now. My backing has now been transferred to Paul Harsley and the lads who will be representing my club against our local rivals in an extremely important match on Saturday.
     
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  17. man

    mansfield_red Well-Known Member

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    This can't be right, otherwise it wouldn't be a release clause. The entire purpose of a release clause is to allow a way out of the contract for less than the strict contractual position. I expect that under the old contract it would have been entirely at our board's discretion whether or not to accept an offer for him, regardless of the amount.

    My inclination is that from the Forest and Sunderland situations he became aware that the club was not prepared to let him leave for peanuts and so he fought to ensure that the contract had a release clause. Didn't he say at the evening with fans that he would be signing a new contract the day after? Yet it took a further 2 weeks for him to sign on the dotted line. That sounds to me like there was a sticking point, and I expect it was the inclusion of the release clause. Whilst all this was going on his agent will have been shopping him around, making sure that clubs are aware that they'll be able to get him for £500k in the coming weeks. Leeds will have made their interest known, and a "gentleman's" agreement put in place for him and his staff to go.

    Christiansen was a dead man walking regardless of the result on Saturday.
     
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  18. Jimmy cricket

    Jimmy cricket Well-Known Member

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    Exactly. I have a very good feeling about Saturday. It’s going to kickstart the season. We are always best when the chips are down. I have faith in the new Paul.
     
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  19. Jimmy cricket

    Jimmy cricket Well-Known Member

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    Let’s be reight we got £125k for Johnson when he left without the clause we wouldn’t have gotten anywhere near the 500k.
     
  20. Ted

    Ted Active Member

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    I agree. I'm all for doing what's best for yourself but it has to be balanced with some integrity.
     

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