In better news...

Can I just say, it's a moot point. Not a mute point. That's something quite different.

 

It's not summat that would normally appeal to me but over the last few months I've been to Europe 10/15 times and will be for the next few months. If that was repeated post Brexit and I had to get Visas I'd be a right pain so if there was a way to avoid it I'd probably take it.

 

Cheers for pointing that out. Never knew it was a different spelling and no one has ever said it before

 

Trouble is Scoff...there's an awful lot of people about who don't have what sounds to be a pretty tidy job like you , and £23 per month or any other figure per month is what they need to actually get by on .
I apologise if your comment was made in jest...it did just come across as a little out of touch if it was meant .

 

I wouldn't so why should I be made to?

 

Fantastic idea - I'd definitely sign up, and happily pay my share into the EU coffers for the privilege.

A couple of people who I know are lucky enough to have grandparents who were born in Ireland. Sadly I'm not, but this looks like it would be the next best thing.

 

Yes, I have a decent job, but the more you earn, the more that life costs you!

I bet most on here spend more than £23 per month on their mobile phone, internet, gambling, drinking, football or Sky TV. Its a matter of choice - what is important for you to spend money on?

 

TBH there are 17million or so that wouldn't, but a lot would especially in London, Scotland and Northern Ireland. I think the suggestion was that it is entirely voluntary.

Lets say it was offered as a one time only deal with a deadline (say end of 2018) to sign up and the option to add any extra kids born after that point. Sign up to pay £x/month to continue to be an EU citizen and continue to gain the benefits including free movement within the EU. You'd still have to pay taxes here and comply with the laws of the UK but would be classed as a British/EU citizen. Anyone not signed up would have to do whatever is agreed by the British government afterwards.

 

Maybe the UK government could take advantage of all this 'control' they've taken back to reduce everybody's tax by the fabled £23 a month? Then those who wanted to could continue to pay it to the EU, and the rest of you could hold onto it?

Of course, that means that Boris, Farage and Gove won't be able to spend it on the NHS like they planned to all along, which is a bit of a shame.

 

Without knowing you or your circumstances, you may spend money on some , or all of those yourself...and then have your £23 quid still left to spend , but I can tell you now , I deal with , and on behalf of people who don't have those advantages , and exist with the help of credit union and sadly foodbanks .
I had suspected your comment was made with humour , your last comment makes me wonder how out of touch your circumstances have made you with the people at the bottom , whose vote and opinion are just as important as yours or mine .

 

This whole thing is personal choice.

If a person wants to retain EU citizenship and have access to free movement.... why shouldn't they be allowed to do so?

If you want to eat bacon, eat bacon, if you want to watch Barnsley, watch Barnsley, if you want to set up camp in a pub, do so. All personal choices that don't impact on other people.

Those who voted out aren't affected at all by this, those who want to stay in get the benefit of free movement out of the UK and across Europe.... so whats the problem?

 

As long as I have the same choice if the tories ever achieve privatisation of the NHS then I'm ok with that.

Ie I continue to pay taxes and NI to receive treatment rather than be plunged into debt and possibly die because I can't afford a thousand quid for a tablet each day.

 

whats that got to do with an opt in system of citizenship?

 

Perhaps you are right, its a long time since 85 when we were at the bottom during the strike (and I was only a kid then), and in the last 20 years I've only spent about a month signing on, so I probably don't know how bad it can get down there now. After I was made redundant, I had to take a massive pay cut leaving me with financial problems, so even though I was earning (relatively) a lot of money the money ended before the month did. It was mostly self-inflicted (over extended myself), but it has taken nearly a decade to recover from financially (and still a few years to go).

However, if the polls are to be believed the people at the bottom voted for Brexit, leaving them open to a future of Tory governments and benefit cuts (along with increasing prices) and reduced governmental investment in the area giving them less chance of getting out of the unfortunate position they are in now.

 

I thought that was obvious.

People who don't want to leave the EU are now coming up with ideas to stay in it.

Going against whatever law is put in place and against what voting systems ee have in place.

It's as simple as that

So I want the same if they ever privatise the NHS as it will also be made in some law.

In other words it will be setting a very dangerous and unworkable precedence on anything voted for in the future

 

it was a non binding referendum... not a general election. It had no manifesto or detail on either side of what would happen or what plans they would work to. So to bind the entire country to something without framework is somewhat bizarre.

Surely democracy is allowing the people to have a say and benefit from that say. 16m want to stay in Europe. 17m voted to come out.

We're coming out, thats not changing. But if 16m want to have free movement IN to Europe, how does that affect you?

And what impact on democracy to take personal choice away from those 16m people? That to me is a much more grave situation.

It seems something of a step to bring some unity and find common ground where all sides have something of what they want.

 

If you want to have free movement IN to Europe then in turn would have to have free movement IN to the UK.

Just a guess but the free and unfettered movement is one of the very issues people may have voted out.

 

"may have voted out"

Indeed, may... because there was no framing of such an issue on the ballot, we'll never know.

The free movement of former states citizens is an optional one. It couldn't be applied in.

So if restrictions on incoming movement are built in, do you have a problem with the 16m Brits who want to stay (and anyone else who chooses to) to be allowed to travel in the EU without having to request visas in advance?

 

I could do with voting out of paying for scroungers, fake disability claimants, MPs expenses, drug rehabilitation programmes, foreign aid and made up initiatives. How are we fixed?

 

Oh and west hams free stadium