Wigan fans View on the Appeal

Discussion in 'Bulletin Board' started by andytyke, Jul 24, 2020.

  1. andytyke

    andytyke Administrator Staff Member Admin

    Joined:
    Mar 9, 2006
    Messages:
    11,413
    Likes Received:
    893
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    Featherstone
    Home Page:
    Style:
    Barnsley (full width)
    From their Forum

    *I think if our new owners came in ran the club for 6 months, pulled all money out, defaulted on bills then we'd have not a leg to stand on as we gained some benefit from the sitaution in the short term and you could argue 'circumstances changed'

    The fact they did this on day 1 volentarily before any bills were defaulted on, immedietely renaging on assurances they gave to the EFL gives us a great chance as the club gained no advantage from, we hadn't missed paying various bills and the ownership blatently lied to the EFL.

    There has never been anything like this in football so the notion that this opens pandoras box for other teams who fell into admin under normal circumstance to appeal is wrong on the grounds that other owners didn't deliberately and needlessly put their clubs into admin the day after completing the takeover.

    It's a unique case and maybe the EFL will screw us, but there is no precedent for this set of circumstances. No other admin resembles this. The EFL rulebook also seems like it has some loopholes we can exploit.*


    *We started the season knowing it ended in May, though it actually run July to June as per player contracts. We are outside of the parameters of the 19/20 season and the regulations we signed up to. The season was extended beyond this without our consent. L1 and L2 had to vote to carry on. Championship clubs weren’t given an option and we had to offer new contracts to finish the season and maintain the competitions integrity. Inconsistency here in approach and legally it’s unchartered territory. By rushing to judgement the efl have created an awful mess for themselves. Any prudent or competent organisation would have just stated they are looking into the legalities of when a penalty can be applied and if applicable due to the over extension of the season. It would have bought them time and avoided the legal **** storm they’ve brought upon themselves. Sadly they aren’t competent.*

    *When there is nothing in the rules to state a points deduction can occur, it would be illegal for the EFL to deduct any points. I think we have a very good chance if the EFL want to avoid a big lawsuit.*

    *The administrators had to contest it to make the club more attractive to any prospective buyers. We’ve not got a chance of getting it overturned imo, we’re not a big club and like we’ve all said numerous times previously, because of that we will get hammered by the EFL.*

    *End of the day, we've been put into administration. When you get put into administration you are deducted 12 points, those are the rules. I admire your optimism, genuinely. I wish I shared it, but alas I strongly suspect you're in for a unpleasant surprise*

    ^^That is not true at all and a complete myth. You don't get deducted points for administration. You get them for not paying creditors. Before us, every club entered administration due to failure to pay creditors. We are a unique case. The rules clearly state we aren't due a points deduction.^^

    *The rule book and regulations have been torn up in the last few months. Legally this is uncharted waters and it only requires us to win on one aspect to quash or defer it.*

    *We have gone in administration that =12 points. Just can’t see us getting away with it let’s just pray we win tomorrow. And we don’t need any help from the. Bent EFL.*

    *The argument is 12 points isn't for going into administration it's for failing to pay your external creditors. Every club before us has only gone into admin after failing to pay while we have gone into admin before failing to pay meaning the punishment has not been correctly triggered yet.

    I think there is also a massive amount of work done by the Latics Twitter detectives into proving the EFL didn't vet the ownership and even Pies'r'us report sent and ignored all help create a case for negligence on their part.

    Then we've got Covid too as another avenue. And the betting stuff, the stock market stuff with IEC, inconsistencies in the owners stories etc.

    A good QC should have plenty to work with and we only need one of those things to work.

    I don't get the pessimism as we have a decent case, but I'm also not confident either as the EFL are *****. I could see it going either way but look how incompet the EFL is generally I'm hoping our QC will wipe the floor with them.*

    *The EFL are carrying out their own investigation into why we were put into administration and this will not be concluded before the end of the season so how the hell can they deduct 12 points until they get the answers. It should be 12 points deduction suspended pending investigation.*

    *Been doing a bit of digging on my goldfish laptop and people in the know and lawyers etc seem to be saying that for a variety of reasons we have a chance with this appeal. It's in new territory and never been appealed before but we are in with a shout.*

    *Everyone in football knows we’ve been screwed, know we’ve been the victim of some corrupt ***** and know the efl are complicit through their own failings in this mess and have compounded the problem. What reputational damage have these wankers caused themselves? Surely the efl sponsors can’t be happy at being associated with such a poorly run organisation? Like uefa and fifa they are not fit to govern the game.*

    *Those nice lot over at Barnsley have left us a message or two... Why did I even look?? I'm just angrier now than I was before. I understand they want to celebrate staying up but not quite sure why it has to be so vindictive?
    They do realise that we haven't been relegated. We've been demoted after finishing in 13th closer to the play offs than them in 22nd!*

    *It's disgusting that we're screwed by fraudulent ownership and get slapped with a points deduction, but Sheff Wed fraudulently gained an advantage (or tried, at the very least) and look to be getting away with it. £60mil they sold Hillsbrough to themselves for ... Dunno if anyone's been there recently but the crap hole needs that much spending on it to make it presentable!

    Irony is, if Choi or Yeung sold the DW to themselves for £40mil, they'd have what looks like a profitable football club and we'd have probably gotten away without any deduction ... Absolute joke*

    * I really hate Barnsley fans*

    *You'll be crying in that sheep dip you call beer in a couple of weeks Jud, then watch your forum explode, look out for me i'll be there.*

    can’t be arsed posting anymore be mainly they are confident they’ll get it over turned

    https://forums.vitalfootball.co.uk/threads/12-point-appeal.106187/
     
  2. dreamboy3000

    dreamboy3000 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Oct 20, 2005
    Messages:
    37,639
    Likes Received:
    4,619
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    DB3K Towers
    Style:
    Barnsley (full width)
    I think my FAO Wigan Athletic thread from the other night needs a bump :D
     
  3. andytyke

    andytyke Administrator Staff Member Admin

    Joined:
    Mar 9, 2006
    Messages:
    11,413
    Likes Received:
    893
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    Featherstone
    Home Page:
    Style:
    Barnsley (full width)
    you do get a mention in that thread lol
     
  4. Ste

    Stephen Dawson Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 25, 2018
    Messages:
    6,296
    Likes Received:
    3,915
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    Style:
    Barnsley (full width)
    They don't seem as clued up legally as some of our posters. They seem bitter and twisted, clutching at straws.
     
  5. Tykeored

    Tykeored Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jun 23, 2017
    Messages:
    1,244
    Likes Received:
    1,112
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    Style:
    Barnsley
    If clubs got deducted points for not paying their creditors then many clubs would be losing points all over the place
     
  6. Jam

    Jamo Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 17, 2014
    Messages:
    4,360
    Likes Received:
    2,528
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Style:
    Barnsley (full width)
    I get that they feel cheated/shafted, but they seem as angry at us as they do at the EFL - how dare we celebrate two injury time winners to (as it stands) keep us up against massive odds after what, overall, has been a ***** season. Some of them really are coming across as entitled, whining bell ends, in complete contrast to Paul Cook who spoke like an absolute gent after the game on Wednesday.
     
    JamDrop, Austiniho, Django and 10 others like this.
  7. Tarntyke

    Tarntyke Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 29, 2005
    Messages:
    8,360
    Likes Received:
    2,583
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    Stairfoot, b4 famous rahnderbart
    Style:
    Barnsley (full width)
    Some of their posters really seem to think they have a chance due to the fact that the 12 points deduction should not be applied for simply going into Administration as they have/ had been paying their creditors. Do they really have a case with this?
     
  8. ley

    leythtyke Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Feb 1, 2019
    Messages:
    516
    Likes Received:
    527
    Trophy Points:
    93
    Gender:
    Male
    Style:
    Barnsley (full width)
    Paul Cook has taken a politician's stance on things since. "We shouldn't be appealing... because we shouldn't be in this position"
     
  9. Men

    Menai Tyke Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 8, 2011
    Messages:
    4,420
    Likes Received:
    1,273
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Llandudno
    Style:
    Barnsley
    Odd one isn’t it. If we hadn’t of scored they would have happily taken the 12 point deduction but because we did they hate us now?
     
  10. Marlon

    Marlon Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 8, 2011
    Messages:
    19,449
    Likes Received:
    7,119
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    HERE.
    Style:
    Barnsley (full width)
    Tbh they were gonna hate whoever finished third bottom because this was gonna happen choose what.
     
  11. onemickybutler

    onemickybutler Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Feb 10, 2007
    Messages:
    3,262
    Likes Received:
    1,249
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Style:
    Barnsley (full width)
    I’m beginning to get a bit worried about this appeal. It could only happen to us....
     
    Stephen Dawson likes this.
  12. Gordon Owen

    Gordon Owen Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 8, 2009
    Messages:
    15,750
    Likes Received:
    4,307
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Tarn, sithi
    Style:
    Barnsley (full width)
    Egg chasing bummers
     
    Donks and Stephen Dawson like this.
  13. icer

    icer Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 2, 2012
    Messages:
    4,233
    Likes Received:
    1,163
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Style:
    Barnsley (full width)
    So Barnsley now are to blame as well as the EFL. I have heard a lot talk about the owners as if they are nothing to do with the club. The betting conspiracy theory was another that seemed to get more air time than the facts and that they had breached the rules. So right now its not 'the clubs' fault, but the EFL and their owners are to blame!!!

    I wonder if the add ons (if any) with the Moore deal included them staying up?

    One thing for sure, i hope the fans are invited into the appeal to give evidence and input.
     
    Stephen Dawson likes this.
  14. Nardiello

    Nardiello Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 12, 2012
    Messages:
    1,232
    Likes Received:
    563
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Style:
    Barnsley (full width)
    I feel bad for Wigan fans - it must be horrible to see your team go down in that way (pending the appeal obviously, which I hope selfishly that they lose)...

    But they're acting as if this is the worst thing to ever happen in football ownership and is unprecedented. It's terrible, but they're not right to complain that other fans don't care/ we shouldn't be celebrating.

    Where were they when worse happened to Bury and Bolton? They've been taken over by someone who the EFL should never have allowed to take them over, and this has led to them going into admin. Admin bears a punishment of 12 points.

    I'm sure their reasonable fans felt sorry for Bury, as we do for Wigan.
     
  15. Ste

    Stephen Dawson Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 25, 2018
    Messages:
    6,296
    Likes Received:
    3,915
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    Style:
    Barnsley (full width)
    :D:D
     
    Donks and RedStriker like this.
  16. Yoyo

    Yoyo Active Member

    Joined:
    Jul 17, 2005
    Messages:
    904
    Likes Received:
    73
    Trophy Points:
    28
    Style:
    Barnsley
    Wigan may have been shafted by the last owners, but like many others in this league they were over spending:


    Contrast this to our wages to turnover figure, albeit the previous season (2nd chart below):

     
  17. nezbfc

    nezbfc Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 13, 2005
    Messages:
    7,598
    Likes Received:
    815
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Its an auto -12 points for entering administration, and then if they fail to agree an IVA (or whatever it is for creditors) then additional points are added.... Aren't they (ie Was it Luton or Rotherham that was hammered with 30)

    The facts are nobody has ever appealed against administration...... Thats the only thing they have to go with, but the rules clearly state -12 for entering admin.
     
  18. Nor

    North Yorks Red Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Oct 12, 2005
    Messages:
    8,899
    Likes Received:
    2,795
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    Style:
    Barnsley (full width)
    Sounds like an idiot or two have been trying to wind them up, unnecessary under the circumstances.
    So he hates Barnsley fans, big deal I can’t stand Wigan for the way they have behaved last season and this,
    Maybe the owner is a gambler, maybe he thought as they were picking up plenty of points they could go into administration dump a lot of creditors in the **** and gambled the points deduction would come this year and they would have enough points to carry it.
    If not they had still dodged the debts and hopefully hung on to Championship status anyway and worry about the 12 points next season
     
  19. ley

    leythtyke Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Feb 1, 2019
    Messages:
    516
    Likes Received:
    527
    Trophy Points:
    93
    Gender:
    Male
    Style:
    Barnsley (full width)
  20. Donny Red

    Donny Red Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Oct 3, 2016
    Messages:
    7,139
    Likes Received:
    5,459
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    Retired.
    Location:
    Ossett.
    Style:
    Barnsley (full width)
    I don't know if I'm over simplifying things, but if the 12 point deduction was going to take place
    surely the Official League table would still have shown us in the bottom three, with an asterisk
    alongside Wigan in thirteenth place on fifty nine points with a note at the foot of the table reading
    " subject to a tribunal decision to be made on 31 st July 2020."
     

Share This Page